Originally Posted by L. Brown
Originally Posted by ChiefAmungum
So here we be.

You can have an argument that has merit. I think that no tox for waterfowl has that. Ducks are not Pheasants, are not Grouse, are not targets. Different needs as far as protecting anything related. The game, the environment, the kiddies. To ban lead for upland hunting is not necessary, period. The upland bird feeds wholly different than waterfowl. Lead is very stable and naturally present in quantity in a lot of places. Just don't pulverize it or vaporize and breath it you'll be fine. It will just lie there. And if you eat a bit I'm sure you'll survive it unharmed!

Why then are the only carrion eaters that get airplay Eagles? Do not Crows and Vultures eat gut piles? Are they suffering?

The problem is that once an idea, which might have merit takes hold someone with an agenda will pick up the ball so to speak and push forward, with their own agenda. Someone like the aforementioned Jen.

Chief

Chief: Unlike eagles, crows and vultures don't have fan clubs. We now have eagles a lot of places where we hadn't had them for a long time. Their recovery is a real success story for wildlife management. Between banning DDT and the nontox requirement for waterfowl hunting, we've pretty much solved the eagle problem. If you see a dead deer along a road in Wisconsin, you're likely to find an eagle cleaning it up. During gun deer season in particular, it's possible that some of those eagles will ingest bullet fragments from deer that were wounded by hunters but not recovered. But I don't think that's a major concern. Far less likely, I think, that an eagle is very likely to feast on a crippled pheasant or grouse and ingest lead shot as a result.

Larry, I think you have to go back to the question of whether lead ingested from other non-waterfowl game has a population level effect on eagles. It is unquestionable that gutpile lead kills eagles. That's not debatable. What is important is whether that has a significant effect on abundances and densities. Clearly, eagle populations have been dramatically successful at increasing in the face of lead-laced carcasses. That is the key point.

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BrentD, (Professor - just for Stan)

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