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Forums10
Topics39,489
Posts561,991
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Most Online9,918
Jul 28th, 2025
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 4,199 Likes: 639
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 4,199 Likes: 639 |
The above accounts were the makings of a Jerry Clower story about Marcel Ledbetter and a game warden...Gil
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1 member likes this:
Stanton Hillis |
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,593 Likes: 101
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,593 Likes: 101 |
50 years ago none of my friends shot SxSs. It has always been a small % of the market. SxSs have been out of favour with the most of the market for 75 yrs.
I have built my business selling SxSs and so far I sell a few more every year.
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2 members like this:
John Roberts, Buzz |
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,893 Likes: 651
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,893 Likes: 651 |
SxSs are old technology. Fully developed, 100-150 years ago depending on how you look at them. So there are few, if any, new modern features beyond recent screw-in chokes, which on a SxS I hate. So there is no modern, hip interest. Two triggers do take a bit of getting use to. It took me about thirty seconds to figure them out and remember to shift my finger. The two trigger excuse, is just an excuse to me, for anyone who can pump a gun can move a finger back and forth. There have been countless times I have seen a semi gun shot dry, while the SxS get the last shot off, to anchor a bird. Fast does not always end up being an advantage.
Value is subjective and is part of demand or perceived demand. If you think something is going to sell fast, sell for top dollar and you think you want it, you will be more willing to pay a higher price. Conversely, if you think something will be difficult to sell, is very common, or easy to find another example, perhaps better or cheaper, you will have little incentive to buy it at all, except under almost giving it away conditions.
Other than guns and muscle cars you see this the most in antiques, a very soft market. What 30 years ago was a hot item, is a total dog these days, in most cases. I settled an estate, with a house full of antiques, fine china, silver and silverware, which 30 years ago would have brought more than the house but which I struggled to find takers within the family for free and selling it was a long and very unsatisfying process. I had many oriental rugs with little demand until I found a dealer who had sold most of the rugs 40-50 years ago, or he and his father had, and he found out I had one very oversized rug he wanted. It was almost 20' X 40' and he said he had not seen one like it for sale in ten plus years. He bought that rug and all the rest for more money that all the rest of the household brought. That rug was really made up of many smaller rugs, perfectly matched and joined together I was told. I went from struggling to get a buyer to a dealer who cut me a check for the low six figures. Right buyer, right item still will bring a dollar. Oriental rugs are not quite a dime a dozen, but they are not rare anymore like when I was a kid.
It is buyer market on the low end guns or antiques, but higher grades or rarer ones will still command a good price. Low grade, common ones have little, a shooters interest, at best, but higher graded ones will still have interest or demand. But even then, there are limits like London double which could be built bought new at $100,000+, that when sold used, will struggle to bring a third of that price.
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 2,071 Likes: 72
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 2,071 Likes: 72 |
i don't know where you guys are at, but it's a tall order to sell field grade (common years ago) sxs's.
Local gun stores want no part of them.
How often does a gun peddler immediately come off his price by 25% just to see if he can get a nibble? Then again I know of two gunshops in KC with doubles in abundance and they move them too. While local markets in many areas maybe be slow, I believe Keith has hit it on the head, good condition properly listed and priced will sell. As he points out Overpriced guns do not move, I too have watched long examples of this. The good condition $400 Sterlingworth I brought in 1985 in the same condition is a $1500>2000 gun today. This is reflected in Ed’s posts too. The current and coming supply of lower end 12 ga guns from Europe may depress the market price for 12 ga BLE/BLNE by filling the market, they will also expand interest in vintage SXS; a gateway drug so to say. The flood is similar to the rush of surplus military arms after Reagan’s rule changes. The supply of mid and higher end vintage SXS guns is such that they have not and will not decline in value except by use or abuse. Lastly as earlier put in Keith’s post money made on a gun is predicated on a good purchase price, over pay and money will be lost down the road. A smart buyer who pays attention to condition and value can avoid a big loss. Most of us insist on learning through mistakes, which I call gun rent, but if you study a bit, control your emotions, you will do ok. I was once concerned about the future value of doubleguns, but I am more concerned about the future of hunting opportunities. My only caveat on vintage SXS values is if the anti-gun crowd slickly sell no lead as they have in the people’s republic of CA. It is a fight we all need to pay attention to.
Michael Dittamo
Topeka, KS
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1 member likes this:
eeb |
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 7,510 Likes: 567
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 7,510 Likes: 567 |
50 years ago none of my friends shot SxSs. It has always been a small % of the market. SxSs have been out of favour with the most of the market for 75 yrs.
I have built my business selling SxSs and so far I sell a few more every year. Agreed. I have many more friends with side-bys now than I did then (exactly zero). Back then "serious hunters and shooters" would only consider an O/U. That has changed slightly to allow more autos, and occasionally an SxS.
_________ BrentD, (Professor - just for Stan) =>/ ![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/qclHjMQ.jpg)
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Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 3,535 Likes: 451
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 3,535 Likes: 451 |
I have heard about SxS's all my life in N. Florida and Alabama. But when I went abroad, I took only a Remington 870 with 20" slug barrel and 28" IC 2 3/4" chambers. That was the one shorgun for me from 1962 till today. However, as mentioned in the Reilly line General Palit made some off-hand comments in India in 1988 as he shot his H&H SxS and I my 870 pump that got me thinking. Essentially he said, "Gentlemen do not use pumps." And this seemed backed up at the time (now 35 years ago) by some published UK snobbery. So in 2015 I bought my first SxS Reilly hammer gun and am not sorry. I have two friends also from the Vietnam War, who shoot SxS's. When we show up on the Sporting Clays course at Bull Run, the younger shooters want to look at the guns and the whiff of tradition, dating from 1725 according to this Michael Yardley article, gets them. There is something more to that SxS than just sport. . . beauty, tradition, balance, aura being some of the qualities. https://www.thefield.co.uk/shooting/the-enduring-appeal-of-the-side-by-side-shotgun-45121I do not collect anything (but Ky. .I do know carpets and there is no-way that main carpet was "sewn together" - that was something special!); I have 5 SxS's (one a muzzle loader) and shoot them all, none being worth more than I paid for them. But though I can still shoot the 870 better than the SxS's. . .(and my son who does Arctic kayaking on salt water swears by his 870 Marine Magnum -nickel plated - polar bear problem). . shooting the double-barrels (and double triggers) is just plain more fun. I could probably go into business selling good condition, non-collectable BLE (or BLNE since I don't really like ejectors on SxS's) out at Bull Run to some of the youngsters. On second thought - no.
Last edited by Argo44; 08/12/23 09:51 PM.
Baluch are not Brahui, Brahui are Baluch
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 6,523 Likes: 162
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 6,523 Likes: 162 |
!
Last edited by Jimmy W; 10/12/24 09:39 AM.
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Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 321 Likes: 76
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 321 Likes: 76 |
My story: I bought a Remington SxS in at a gun show in Anchorage 1982, I paid $400. We moved back to AZ in 1990, I sold the SxS at a gun show In AZ for $600.(new business financial stress). I found the phone number of the gent I sold the gun to in 2019, after two years and a visit to MN I bought the gun back for $2,000! I has happy and so was the seller! Value....who knows.....
The Pigeon Gun (Damascus) is on page 224-225 of Semmers book
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 6,523 Likes: 162
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 6,523 Likes: 162 |
I keep hearing the tired old line that we are a dying breed, and the next generation of shooters will have zero interest in double shotguns. If this was true, then actual selling prices would not have increased as much as they have over time. I just don't see doubles selling for less than they did 10 or 20 years ago, and that includes lowly American made field grade 12 gauge guns. I watch trends in Syracuse Lefevers more intently than most other guns. Actual selling prices keep going up, and on auction sites like GunBroker, there are just as many bidders as in the past, if not more. In addition, the screen names of bidders is not the same old guys who were competing to buy years ago. Interest is absolutely continuing and evolving. I expected to see some cheap plums coming out of closets in the aftermath of the 2008 Great Recession, and instead, most gun prices kept rising. I keep waiting for the prices to collapse because the Chicken Little's have been crying for so long that the sky is falling, and it has not happened. Look at the prices in a 20 or 25 year old Gun List or Shotgun News, and you will wish you had a time machine.
And anyone who thinks the only real interest in guns these days is in semi-auto handguns and high capacity semi-auto rifles with plastic stocks simply hasn't been paying attention to how much prices have increased over the past decade or so for old lever action rifles and revolvers. Dirt cheap single shots for wildcat conversions and barrels full of cheap military rifles that were used for sporterizing are a thing of the past too. Guns that languish on dealers racks for years due to totally unrealistic asking prices prove only that the dealer paid too much, or is hoping a sucker with more money than brains comes in to his store.
Of course, some of that increase over time is simply due to overall price inflation. And there certainly are exceptions and market fluctuations. Guns are not likely to be as good an investment over time as the S&P 500. But like any investment, you have to buy and sell intelligently. It would be tough to make consistently great returns on stocks, precious metals, or real estate if you bought at market peaks and paid 25% commissions on both the front and back end. But gun guys do that quite often, and then say they are happy to know they will likely take a loss when they sell or trade. That's just dumb. Guys who paid full blown retail for many English doubles when the market for them was red hot would see a loss if they sold now. But that seems to be largely due to large numbers of English shooters dumping their guns due to anti-gun regulations and lead shot bans. Supply and demand still matters.
The same could happen here if some U.S. gun owners don't pull their heads out of their asses, and keep on voting for anti-gun Democrats. Guys who stab us in the back by voting against our interests and our 2nd Amendment Rights are no help to us or the long term value of our guns. .
Last edited by Jimmy W; 10/12/24 09:40 AM.
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