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Forums10
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Most Online1,344 Apr 29th, 2024
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,438 Likes: 316
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,438 Likes: 316 |
John: different maker and old data, but possibly helpful Kent/Gamebore English Field 12g 2 1/2” White Gold XLR 21gm (3/4 oz.) was listed at 1250 fps with a pressure of 7975 psi
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Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 460 Likes: 12
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 460 Likes: 12 |
You are right, 21g is 3/4 oz. My mistake. However the other data is current from Hull Cartridge Co's website here https://www.hullcartridge.co.uk/clay/cartridges/comp-x21g is a popular load for clays here and several makes are widely available, Eley, Hull, Fiocchi, Lyevale/Express. They are well suited to older guns.
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,396 Likes: 107
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,396 Likes: 107 |
British muzzle velocity figures can be confusing to us Yanks. I remember reading Gough Thomas who reported the muzzle velocity of shells he was testing at 1070 fps. (Standard game loads.) That is "observed velocity," which is the average over 20 yards (or meters, I forget which.) Those loads have a velocity of 1175 fps as we measure MV on this side of the pond--which is at 3 feet from the muzzle. On the other hand, if you get a British MV reading in the 1400 fps range, that's almost certainly taken at the muzzle. "True" muzzle velocity, which is faster in comparison to our 3 foot velocity.
When shooting on cold days (much below freezing) on skeet squads with a shooter who's using those low recoil loads, they tend to sound decidedly "poofy". But then most shooters aren't as crazy as some of us in northern Wisconsin are. They're doing something other than shooting targets when it's that cold.
Last edited by L. Brown; 11/12/22 09:10 AM.
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,438 Likes: 316
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,438 Likes: 316 |
What Larry said, but it doesn't need to be confusing. The Commission Internationale Permanente pour l'Epreuve des Armes à Feu Portatives standard is to report velocity at 2.5 meters = 8.2 feet from the muzzle. https://www.cip-bobp.org/en/cipVelocity at the SAAMI standard of 3 feet is about 70 fps less than the muzzle. Apparently if British shells are for domestic use, the domestic maker can use British standards. Maybe a British correspondent could confirm. If for export (clearly applicable to the current Italian and Spanish products) the shot size and speed is reported in "American"
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 4,092 Likes: 486
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 4,092 Likes: 486 |
More than enough velocity for snipe and woodcock, especially woodcock shot at dog held range. Gil
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Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 3,186 Likes: 336
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 3,186 Likes: 336 |
Shells arrived. Turns out the load is 26 grams, 15/16 oz as Drew originally posted, not 7/8. I'll be shooting them in a Saint Etienne 1926 Wonder 12 bore (18.2) with 3/4 chokes in each barrel chambered for 65mm, 27 1/2" barrels and plenty of metal (I've actually shot the Federal 1 1/8" oz 1145 fps 2 3/4 rounds in this gun without a problem); And an 1897 Reilly 12 bore Damascus 30" barrels SxS choked cylinder and 1/4, 2 1/2" chambers. We'll see how they do. Right now I'd opt for a sling shot. (One could always shoot the 870's but....life is short).
Last edited by Argo44; 11/14/22 11:55 AM.
Baluch are not Brahui, Brahui are Baluch
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Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 356 Likes: 34
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 356 Likes: 34 |
It's a popular load with the cowboy shooters, especially among the competitive shooters and those shooters that are recoil sensitive. I'll agree that the load borders on useless for skeet and trap.
Last edited by Chantry; 11/14/22 12:22 PM.
I have become addicted to English hammered shotguns to the detriment of my wallet.
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Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 3,186 Likes: 336
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 3,186 Likes: 336 |
There is a lot of experience on this board with this load. Today was my first try, though, shooting them from French 1926 2 1/2" chambered "Wonder."
I was truly surprised at the pep. I thought they'd sort of fall out of the barrel. It was a cold day by Virginia standards (summerish for Ted and the Canadians). They worked very well on sporting clays. I don't shoot much skeet or trap so the experienced opinions for those games posted here are valid. But I will be shooting the Damascus 12 with them this weekend. Again, quite a pleasant surprise. They should do till RST gets back up to speed unless I can find a better commercial shell for 2 1/2" chambered 125 year old Damascus.
Last edited by Argo44; 11/16/22 10:42 PM.
Baluch are not Brahui, Brahui are Baluch
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 9,788 Likes: 767
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 9,788 Likes: 767 |
Gene, Bet your French gun has tight bores. They work best in guns that are snug. My lefty Darne had a fearsome backbore perpetrated on it, some time before my ownership. They didn’t work in that one.
I would think you might get away with hunting Snipe, woodcock, grouse, or quail with the 7 1/2 loading. Pheasants, not so much.
Best, Ted
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Joined: May 2016
Posts: 1,421 Likes: 198
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 1,421 Likes: 198 |
Argo, Since the unavailability of RST shells, I've been shooting Fiocchi and Rio 12 ga. 2 3/4" 7/8 oz. at 1200 fps loads with great results in my 2 1/2" chambered Churchill. Basically a soft shooting 20 ga. load is what it feels like to me. Karl
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