doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Nash Buckinghams Fox "HE"..

Askins discusses the bore dimensions of the best barrels they did in his book "Modern Shotguns and Loads." Except for a few thousandths more choke, the bores of my Super-Fox measure just as Askins describes in "Modern Shotguns and Loads" 1929, Small-Arms Technical Publishing Co., top of page 82. However, mine came from the factory chambered for 3-inch shells, and Askins was describing a 2 3/4 - inch chambered gun. Bore .738 inch to within 5.5 inches from muzzle, then tapered for an inch into enlargement to .740 inch, thence at 4.5 inches from muzzle choke constriction starts narrowing regularly to a choke constriction of .692 inch. The total constriction was therefore .048”. In my gun the total constrictions are a bit more at .051” left and .053” right.

Hmmm, I wonder if the .002 "jug" is intentional or just something that occurred on that set? Planning a .002 jug in a .050ish choke seems insignificant.

Backboring about .010 may have been the thing that allowed the .010 tighter than normal to work without blowing the pattern??

I'm wondering if the overbore allowed for some additional(has to be some in any gun/shot) gas blow-by that caused the funny sound?

Some Super Foxes are as large as .750, some are only .740. Of course, the question was directed to "Becker bored Foxes". There are .750 bore Supers whose factory order cards say nothing about Becker boring the gun. Further, not all monster bore HE guns are 3" chamber. The .740 and .750 bores seem to appear on both 2 3/4" and 3" Supers. As Researcher implies, chokes over .050 are not uncommon in HE Grade 12 gauge guns. I have never measured a 20 gauge HE barrel, but I will put it on my "to do" list.

There shouldn't have been any blowby in a .750 back in the old days. I measured some Remington fiber wads and card wads and they fit tight as a tick in my .750 Super barrels. I measure them after trying them in the bore and they measured exactly .750. The fiber wad may have been a bit bigger before I ran it into the bore, don't know. The bad news is that a AA plastic wad is only .740 so it should be loaded fairly hot to seal in a .750 barrel. However, today's overbored skeet barrels are in the .740s and seem to seal just fine with plastic wads. I may load a few of the fiber wads and cards in good AA empties and large shot and see what I can get out of them. I can't think of a better combination than low velocity, mushy fiber wads, big hard shot, and a .750 bore with over .050 of choke. I may shoot some 100% patterns if I use a shot cup and some buffer. I'll report back in about five years when I get to this project.

Bill,
I'm almost certain all shots in shotguns have some blowby. If not, they have perfected the dynamic gas seal beyond anything that could be hoped for with just a piece of cardboard and felt.

Is is possible/probable that Becker developed the bore dims for Fox and these dims were then used on production guns by whoever was working in production?

Aw come on gents. It just an ol'Fox. I have a cowboyed one disassembled now on my workbench.



Why all the hubbub? Anyone but me and Walt want to discuss a REALLY interesting gun, namely the NID Magnum Doubles?

Regards

GKT

I passed my NID Magnum on to the Hartmann brothers. It was just too heavy!!

Researcher...

I have found that a caisson and wheels is a big help in getting the thing to the goose pit.

Seriously, if you work out a bit , its not too bad, and the weight sure does soak up the recoil. Ok, mebbe not, even heavy still kicks pretty good.

On the other hand, those 3-1/2" shells can be quite effective. Docbill used his , for a while anyway, on crows conducting agricultural depredations ( they can wreak havoc in a pecan orchard). The weight really smoothes your swing.

Regards

GKT

All:

M.V. Highsmith has surpassed 85 years and is on a slipperly downhill slope. His short-term memory is lacking but he still goes to work most days. I spent hours with him, inquiring and reading from his library(after he retired for the evening after several stiff highballs of "Wild Turkey" and springwater) as well as getting clues on doubles that I took with me. I also had to repair icemaker("Wild Turkey" highballs w/out ice is a crime), assist Mrs. Highsmith in purchasing a LCD tv and other sundry things. I plan to return in the near future to inquire more. High referred to the Becker as a "Super Fox." We talked of Horace who defined Capt. Harold Money, an Englishman(Limey(?) according to Highsmith), as the "De Shootinest Gent'man." He had another book by an Englishman from the turn of the century by Capt. Money with different initials(Blue Rock) on Pigeon Shooting, whose photo was somewhat similar. Yes, sandwiched between pages 140-141 is a plate with "Frank" and an 1893 converted to 1897 Winchester trombone and the flip side is "Bo-Whoop" and the 1893 converted to 1897, which Mr. M.V. Highsmith adamantly referred to as "a 1897." More later.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

In the last 10 years it's became hard to get any info out of him....he was known as one of the best shotgun shots in the south at one time.