doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Ithaca NID single trigger ca. 1926

Here's the internal parts of the trigger.

If that's the only stock problem, then I wouldn't restock it...then you've got a re-stocked NID...that stock can be easily repaired with a bowtie or a BX staple, inletted into the face of the stock...then the little poor inletting that's left (around the top tang) can be filled with colored acra-gel...

Looks McGraw engraved...

See the end of the screw, on the top tang, behind the safety button.? Notice the relationship to the surface of the top tang...If you alter this screw as little as 1/4 to 1/2 turn in either direction, chances are that you will have single trigger problems...so keep that in mind if you re-stock it, or just tighten and glue the original stock..

the trigger itself doesn't look like any Miller's that I've seen, but there are many Miller variations that I've not seen...

My guess is that it's a Howland trigger, maybe even an illegitmate cousin of a Miller ...that's probably too harsh of a comparison, but I believe that Ithaca was fitting their guns with single triggers long before they enjoyed patent protection for the mechanism...This is not the first time I've seen that under-cut trigger on an Ithaca either, (as others will probably tell you)...

If you have the right screwdrivers to remove the stock, and show pics, there is a 50/50 chance it could be identified. The fact that it's selective rules out Howland's second or third triggers...so logically the first comparisons would be the 1931 Howland design, and the 1925 EE Miller.

It's interesting to wonder what happened between Ithaca and EE Miller, because EE averaged a new patent trigger nearly every other year in the 20's (6 pats), then in '29 he stopped, only to start up again nearly a decade later...early in that same decade, that started out in the Depression, Howland patented at least three trigger designs...so I wonder...did EE Miller get chopped up by the Depression or did Ithaca stop using his trigger for economic reasons? Why was Ithaca pressing for their own Howland design? Did they do it because Miller was out of operation during those Depression years, or did they have a falling out with EE Miller as they did with Emil Flues?

Your pictures posted while I was typing the last post

I would say this is it, a 1931 Howland/Ithaca factory trigger...now do you see the anomolies here? 1926, and a 1931 design trigger...

Robert,
Thanks much. This Howland design appears to be very simple in its function. It also seems to be very tolerant of upper to lower tang relationship. Now that I understand how it works I believe it will be reliable.

Unfortunately, the stock has been grafted at the wrist and not done all that well. The entire stock aft of the wrist is a replacement. It has also been butchered up in the inletting to allow some unknowing hack to remove the stock without removing the sears. And so I have no reservations about restocking the gun as it will never be the "original" stock ever again.

I almost forgot...to give credit where cridet is due...Howland's third trigger design, that Researcher cited, from 1935, was also the design work of Nestor Smith...

As far as I know, your gun is the first to be positively and publicly identified as having the first model Howland/Ithaca factory single trigger...I've seen others and owned one, but I was alone in my observations before this. Now lets see a Smith with factory Hurst ejector system...

This is odd because I once owned a VHE parker with the same trigger mechanism and selector arrangement, it was even stamped the same as Chucks gun in front of the safety. It had Miller stamped on the trigger, strange???

Jim

I know what you mean, is does look like a Miller trigger, but so does the Howland trigger, it's not strange, it's a Miller copy...well maybe, because we really don't know what happened to the Miller/Ithaca relationship during the Depression...AND chances are that the currently accepted production dates for those years are incorrect...

Would you like me to post more drawings of the Howland trigger and Miller drawings for comparison?

Look at the Howland drawing that is posted above...it looks exactly like a Miller trigger to me, but apparently the patent office thought there was enough differences to grant the patent in the same thread 42/42.01

It's possible that the Howland design was implemented before the patent was granted. If the patent had been applied for, it would be somewhat plausable for the trigger to be on a gun several years earlier. But, 5 years?

That's why I offered to post the Miller 1925 patent drawing. The Howland trigger is so close, that I can't tell easily...They look exactly alike to me...there must be some serious difference other than the shape of the trigger itself, or the patent office wouldn't granted the patent to Howland in 1931..the '25 Miller soon to follow...