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Have you noticed that very few English boxlocks exceed 28� in length? Certainly some older BP proofed examples were 30�, but generally speaking, 28� is the maximum standard length. This observation tends to hold across all gauges.

I have been reflecting on the paucity of long barreled boxlocks for several years without reaching any conclusions. Recently, however, I was examining my 12 alongside my 20 (both 28� lightweights) and realized that the balance point on both examples was 3/4� ahead of the hinge pin. These 28 inchers are decidedly barrel heavy which promote a natural forward allowance and follow through in a hunting context. I am not confident that 29� or 30� barrels would improve the dynamics of those offered by the 28�s. My sidelocks in lightweight configurations seem to require 29� or 30� to achieve a similar dynamic feel and and tend to be several ounces heavier as compared to the comparable 28� boxlock. I am beginning to believe that the answer to the question originally posed is that makers were fond of the 28� length because they could achieve a satisfactory balance and feel for those desiring a barrel heavy hunting implement at the 28� length and decided that further length was unnecessary.

Do others feel similarly regarding the 28� boxlock? I would love to hear from anyone who owns and utilizes both 28 and longer barreled boxlocks and can speak to the relative perceived dynamics of the various barrel lengths.

The strangest feeling I ever had handling a new shotgun was in Fort William, Scotland with a light 12 Churchill XXV boxlock. Three inches the other way sure made a huge difference---weird, to me.

Not really. Actually, I've never handled a 28" box lock gun, of any nationality, that I felt was barrel heavy. I have, and shoot, boxlocks with from 26" to 32" barrel lengths, and I can honestly say dynamics have little to do with barrel length. Gun designers and barrel strikers can make a 32" gun handle almost whippy, or make a 28" barreled one handle sluggishly. Each gun has to be evaluated on it's individual handling characteristics, regardless barrel length. That said, I find myself to be much more favorable of longer 30-32" barreled doubles than shorter 26-28"ones.

Trying to come up with a standard, as you're doing with 28" guns, assumes that all shooters are built the same, with the same length arms and musculature. But, we are not. Longer armed shooters have greater leverage on the gun, and a 32" barreled gun, for them, may handle the same as a 28" barreled one in the hands of a shorter armed shooter. The possible combinations of arm length, musculature and shooting style are endless. Thus, the individual preferences of shooters. Hence, what you refer to as barrel heavy may feel entirely different to me.

SRH

Owen, I measure guns for their objective handling characteristics; much as stock fit dimensions are measured. If you measure the weight, tetter-totter balance point to (front) trigger, moment of inertia at balance point (unmounted swing effort) and calculate moment of inertia at butt (mounted swing effort) you have a complete picture of the guns handling. The only trick here is to work out how you actually wish a gun to handle for which purpose it will be used.

Considering all shooters do not use the same stock dimensions, it seems likely that all shooters will not require the same handling.

Post back if you have questions. Happy to discuss.

DDA

Owen, I find lots of 30" English box locks. All I have to do is try to find a nice one fitting my criterion of 28" or shorter and 30" barrels are suddenly all over.

I'll give it a "shot. I have 2 older 12 bore 28" barreled shotguns-- (1) L.C. Smith Pigeon Grade 7lb. 4 oz. (2) Win. M21 7 lb. 6 oz.- both have almost identical stock dims, zero cast, and recoil pads and 14&1/4" LOP-- The Smith has the straight hand (English) grip and DT-- The Win. M21 has a pg, and a SST- Both are choked imp. cyl. and mod. and have 2&3/4" chambers.

Tell you what- I am far from ever owning a "Matched Pair" of Best Guns- but I have shot both guns on preserve pheasants- a "Big Day" where our club has a morning shoot, then a nice lunch, then an afternoon shoot- (all the birds and cleaned and then donated to the local VA Hospital for a feast, by the way)-- 10 guns, we usually kill and retrieve 200 birds or more-- I use the M21 for the AM shoot, and the Pigeon Grade for the PM shoot, or-vice versa, depending on my mood. Except for the trigger confirmations, I shoot either gun equally afield.

I agree with Stan on the longer barrels however- the rest of my 12 bore Smiths have either 30" or 32" barrels- I use one of those for the Tower "European" events- and they have tighter chokes. RWTF

Every English boxlock I ever owned was 30�, except for one that was 29�.

Best,
Ted

Stan & Rocketman, You make fair points and I willingly accept the criticism. It is very difficult to generalize concerning any gun type or category of gun. My comment concerns only English guns as I do not own or have any knowledge of typical specifications or dynamics of non-English guns.

How about if I modify my working theory � � the 28 inch barrel length platform was sufficient for English makers to construct guns with a variety of Teeter-totter points MOI, etc. to satisfy the desired dynamics and handling characteristics requested by customers. Let�s examine teeter totter point as a specific variable. That is an objective measurement that can be performed on a gun and tends to indicate whether the weight is forward, balanced, or in the stock. I would argue that the 28 inch boxlock platform was sufficiently versatile to handle the varying requests from sportsman for a teeter totter point 1� ahead of the trigger to 1� behind the trigger. There was, therefore, no need to resort to longer barrels to meet the requirements of the sportsman desiring a weight forward gun.

I think Greener kinda� tried to make the same point, but, he was specifically talking 25� tubes.
I�m not a really big guy, but, 25� tubes only feel right to me on my grouse gun. I like 28� tubes on my pheasant guns, especially later in the season, or, when it is really cold.
I can offer no scientific evidence of why I like it like this. But, some guys dismiss a 25� set of barrels out of hand.

Best,
Ted

I have one 25" gun, my grouse gun and I shoot it just fine. I grab the 29" H&H for roosters though. I can and have shot a bunch of 30" guns at roosters and like them just fine. A longer LOP like mine seems to balance out better visually with slightly longer barrels.