doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com 16 gauge reloading

I have two old 16 gauge pumps.
They will not cycle anything but the old Winchester CF hulls.
Has anyone found a newer 16 gauge hull that will work in an old 16 gauge pump? (a 1934 Remington 31 and a 1949 Ithaca 37 both with 2 3/4 " chambers)
Pete

The issue is curable in some old guns by polishing the chambers. The brass washed steel heads give some guns fits, but it's not limited to old guns. A modern 870 12 that I own won't cycle Remington promos but will cycle Winchester cheapies. Figure that one out. My M12 16 won't cycle the Herter purples but digests all others. On an Ithaca M37 16, the cure was having Les Diamond re-cut the extractor notches on the barrel which helped the extractors line up and grip the rims better. Solid brass heads were more forgiving. The move to steel heads has been a game changer. Gil

If those pumps are old enough that they have the 2 9/16" short chambers, then it's unlikely they'll cycle most modern 2 3/4" 16ga hulls. Ejection port issue. A friend's old Model 12 will chamber 2 3/4" 16's OK, but won't cycle them.

Contact Les Hovencamp at Diamond Gunsmithing. He was the head smith at Ithaca at Ithaca NY. He can remedy the M37's issue with new shells. My 1949 16 37R handles the shells fine, but my later model in 16, 1958, was sent to Les for cure. Gil

RST (Cheddite) 2 1/2" hulls
Ched 209 Primer
19.8 grains IMR SR7625 powder
BP/SPTG16 wads
< 7000 psi, 1125fps

Cycled perfectly in my '39 Model 12, 16 gauge Solid Rib Skeet (2 3/4 " chambers)


Beautiful crimps with 1 oz, 7/8 oz and even 3/4 oz
You'll need the Short Kit lift plate for a MEC

Thank guys, I think I'll try the RST hulls, I have tried the Cheddite 2 3/4 inch hulls without much luck, they won't cycle, but maybe the 2 1/2 inch hulls will work.

Nice looking model 12.
Pete

Remington Game Load hulls are the shortest of the 2 3/4 hulls.

Assuming both guns have original barrels mated to the receivers there should be no problem with ejecting 2 3/4" hulls. You might need to look elsewhere for the problem.

A friend o mine once brought an early Browning 16 gauge A5 for me to look at which he was considering buying. It was giving ejecting problems when he test-fired it. This gun had the push forward through the front of the trigger guard safety, BUT, had a 2 3/4" chambered barrel on it.

I looked at it & explained to him it was an early 2 9/16" gun which had been retrofit with a later 2 3/4" barrel without the ejection port having been modified. I then told him what would have to be done to make it work.

He decided since it was no longer original he would pass on it & try to find another more to his liking, which I felt was a smart move.

One thing that was not clear in the OP's first inquiry. What part of the cycle is faulty? Extraction after firing, ejecting after firing, or chambering loaded rounds?

The rounds are hard to chamber and very hard to eject.
Pete

Are the troublesome shells you use unfired commercially bought or fired reloads? If fired reloads, the heads may need resizing if you haven't already done so. If you are reloading hulls from a skeet field, sometimes the chambers from which they were shot may be slightly larger than your old pumps' chambers. Just a thought.... Gil

Thank you GLS,
They are resized with the Mec collet on my Mec 9000.
But when I use new shells I have the same problem.
The only shells that work are the old Winchester shells, And they work as slick as could be.
Pete

Is it the head or plastic or both that causes the issue? I've read where at the end of the life of old gunmakers' chamber reamers because of wear and resharpening, the tool is slightly smaller in diameter and reams smaller chambers. I read it on the internet so it has to be true. Google "Polishing shotgun chambers." There are several videos on the simple procedure using a chamber brush, fine steel wool, electric drill and oil. Might be worth trying, but it maybe the old chambers are a tad too tight and worth doing something to correct the issue. Good luck. Gil

Some years back a cousin of mine brought me an Ithaca 37 to look at. It belonged to a friend of his & was having problems ejecting hulls (After firing). On opening the gun the extractor would jump the rim & leave the empty hull fully in the chamber. It belonged to a friend of my cousin & had been to a couple of "Gunsmiths". One had put in a new extractor. Don't know what the other did, but neither had helped him.

I took the barrel off, took one look into the breech, there was a big rusty spot about midway of the chamber. I went to the shop, removed the rust "Bulge" & then polished the chamber with mild abrasive so as to smooth it but not remove any measurable amount of metal.

The owner had sent along some of the shells which were giving him trouble. We shot several of them & they all ejected fine. My cousin moved to a different location a couple of rs later, but last I had heard it had given no more problems.

Thanks GLS and 2-piper, The first gun that gave me trouble was the Ithaca 37, I looked in the chamber and it was very rough, it looked like someone had reamed the chamber with a corkscrew.
I used a chamber "Flex Hone" to polish it . It looked very much smoother but it still gave me trouble. I put it away and didn't use it for a long while.

Then I got the Remington 31 in 16 gauge and I again had trouble.
Then I thought of the ammo I was using and I tried various brands and I found the old Winchester dove and quail loads worked great in the Remington and so I tried the Ithaca 37 and Eureka! they worked in that gun too.

Now the problem is to find a stash of Winchester dove and quail hulls or find another new shell that will work.
Thanks for the help. Pete