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I have recently encountered an LC Smith Pigeon grade 12 ga shotgun. It is in good shooting condition with barrels tight on face etc. It is chambered in 2-3/4 chambers and chokes are modified and full. It has the selectable trigger and ejectors. The shotgun has been re-blued, but unfortunately that includes the receiver. The price is only 1550....cheap in general for this model gun. However, given it's refinish issues, is it worth this money? I thought about just buying it and trying to just chemically strip the blue from the receiver and leave it silver. Alternatively I guess I could consider recasing the receiver. What do you guys think. Thanks. Arnold Wenger

Welcome, Arnold.

I'd first determine if the gun has been hot blued. If so, I'd walk away. Then, if the barrels have been cut, and/or if the chokes are original, or suitable. Have the bores measured for evidence of back-boring or excessive honing. If all the above checks out okay, if the rib's joints are sound, and the wood is decent, that's probably a decent price.

SRH

My only experience with a blued receiver was a 20g. Smith Field Grade. When I stripped the bluing the receiver looked like it had Chicken Pox and a bad case at that. I had it annealed, cleaned it up and recase colored it. It was an expensive lesson.

My first graded Smith was a 12 bore Pigeon Grade- DT-EJ straight hand buttstock to black leather faced pad-28" choked Imp. cyl right and Imp. mod left- 1909 yom- all 12 bore Smith had std. 2&3/4" chambers--so that's not a concern. But being a long-time Smith collector and shooter (mainly 12 gauge pre-1913 guns) some things are of concern, to me anyway.

I'd want to run a few boxes of target loads through this gun before I wrote a check- the HOT concerns me--if it functions w/o flaw in either Rb or Lb selection mode- you are lucky-- also, you probably know that the safety remains on fire mode once you have moved it, the automatic safety mechanism will not quite fit into the stock head due to the greater amount of wood removed to allow the HOT to function.

I'd give up on the stripping the blued lockplates-- if it fits you, shoots to POA- the trigger and ejectors function properly, and the stock dims are correct for you, I'd make the owner a offer, keep it and shoot it as is- You will never recover the costs you are thinking about putting into this Smith to "make it right"-- IMO..

Also, back in the era this Pigeon grade was made- both barrels choked full was factory std- check muzzle area for concentricity and any hone marks, buying a older gun with opened up chokes or cut down barrels is a risky business. RWTF

Does it have the safety?

The next time you offer a gun for sale, keep that in mind!!

I would check the engraving to see if it was over polished before it was blued. If the engraving is sharp the blue can be removed with CLR (at your local grocery store). Pour the CLR in a container large enough to hold the receiver, put the parts in and let set for 30 minutes or so. Be sure to disassemble the action first, CLR is mild so it will not pit or damage the metal within reason, it can be diluted with water. Polish with a gray 3m pad carefully.

If you are referring to my reply, I always offer a 5 day inspection option on ANY shotgun I have for sale (are you paying attention, Eddie Goode?) Full refund except for shipping costs) and a firing option, as long as reloads are not used. If you doubt my word, send me a private e-mail message via the PMS gizmo on Dave's website, and I will respond with the gentleman's name and address- and yes, I have his permission to use his name as reference to my honesty and integrity-

I do NOT post any shotguns I may have for sale (none at present FYI) due to the azenholer trolls that seem to have nothing better to do but pick the fly scheise from the pepper here--waste of time. I deal mainly in pre-1913 L.C. Smiths- it is my understanding that the LCSCA does NOT allow members to advertise guns for sale, or even WTB.. So, my few sales are to private networked clients. RWTF

Just FYI LCSCA have a buy sell private forum for members.

Thanks for the info, Mark. As of now, I do not have any graded Smiths in my small collection for sale-But I'll surely keep that in mind. RWTF

Sorry it took so long to get back. The barrels have not been cut. My Galazan choke ga shows modified and full. Engraving is sharp....not polished looking. Barrels ring nice no sign of loose ribs. Bores don't look honed but the Chambers are a full 2 3/4" not 2 5/8 like my nominally 2-3/4 1903 Parker VH or my 1927 AH Fox. Chambers were also checked by me using my Galazan gauges. The gunsmith who has this on consignment has agreed to let me fire a few light trap loads in his ammo trap. The selective single trigger seems to work with snap caps. I may make an offer as it has now been there over a month. Can't hurt anyway. If I pull the trigger on a purchase (pun intended!) I guess I would have a decision to make as to strip bluing from the receiver or leave it alone. Thanks for the thoughts

Arnold: from the beginning of the Smith hammerless in 1886, chambers were bored 2 3/4" unless otherwise indicated on the barrel flats.

1910 Norvell-Shapleigh, St. Louis catalog. $188 in 1910 is about $5000 today.



If you get the gun you might enjoy "The L.C. Smith Pigeon Gun" in The Double Gun Journal, Volume 22, Issue 2, p. 110, 2011.

Some information here
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1rtqfXbMHv08c0iojRUFUV5kR7jIc-7jdinPZEmI9WSc/preview

It is also possible that a Research Letter might document the original purchaser. If so, let us know and I'll see if I can find any information regarding the shooter.
https://lcsca.clubexpress.com/content.aspx?page_id=22&club_id=43784&module_id=245742

A 1913 Lefever Arms Co catalog states that all their 12 ga guns are shipped with 2 3/4" chambers "unless" otherwise ordered. I do not know at what point this took effect, but a Ca 1892 gun of mine SNd 20633 has 2 5/8" chambers while one @ #29,471 has 2 3/4" chambers. All my 12 gauge Lefevers with higher numbers than this one have 2 3/4" chambers. I am thinking, but not certain, they changed to the 2 3/4" chambers about the time they changed to the large single cocking hook.

I am not positive if anyone intentionally bored barrels with 2 5/8" chambers & marked them for 2 3/4" shells other than Parker Bros.

PS; I also have a post-1907 H grade LAC 16 gauge with 2 3/4" chambers. It has regular (Short) forcing cones & there is no indication the chambers have been lengthened, likely ordered that way. It has 28" Twist barrels, full choked in both barrels & weighs in @ 6 3/4 lbs, so likely built as a Duck gun.