doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Lightweight Guns

Having spent a log time now testing guns of all ages from 1862 through to WW2 it struck me on Saturday as I shot my way through 92 woodpigeons (with a John Manton hammer (8lb) gun and a Westley Richards 'drop-lock' (6lb 12oz) that were feeding on some cut wheat fields, how quickly one feels whether a gun is a 'shooter' or not.

I'm not talking about fit here: it is a given that if the gun is a very poor fit, you will struggle to shoot well with it and will therefore not rate it very highly.

The factor that immediately sprung to mind was weight. A preperly balanced gun feels lighter than it is but a properly weighted gun absorbs recoil and steadies the shot, making each one more repeatable and rhythmic.

To put it bluntly, I have developed a dislike for lightweight guns. They tend to kick too much, even when loaded with 1oz (12-bore), they are less steady to shoot and less pleasant.

I have developed a preferance for a 12-bore that weights around 7lb; certainly no less than 6lb 10oz. as for the real lightweights - the 5lb 8oz and 6lb 12-bores - in my experience bloody awful to shoot for an extended period.

Don't mistake the issue of weight as meaning that I like big, agricultural chunks now - the gun has to be very well made and balanced, not just heavy. Plenty of heavy guns are not very nice to shoot because they have no 'life' in them.

What think you?

Dig,
I tend to agree with you. But go maybe a little further in suggesting that the gun weight be a match to the loads being shot. The 96:1 formula may work for many for a 1200fps load, but too often here in the states we have game loads that are 1300fps or even higher. Also, I've found I like a no lighter than 6lb even gun for standard 1200fps 7/8 oz 20ga loads.

For some of the 12g loads common for pheasant at around 1 1/4 oz traveling anywhere from 1200 up to 1400 fps, I want a heavy gun, maybe 7 1/2 lbs. But realistically, I don't shoot that heavy of a load that often. Sometimes, I find myself shooting a 20g with 1 oz at 1300 fps on pheasant out of either a 6 1/2lb gas gun or my 6 1/4lb Superposed.

On the other hand, sometimes I shoot a 6 1/2lb vintage damascus 12g Parker with 1 oz going 1150 fps on quail and pheasant and it is a very gratifying gun to shoot.

So, in general, I'm in agreement with you. The lightweight gun chase has limits.

I'm with you Dig. To a point.

On those hunts where you walk a dozen miles for three shots, the real merits of a lightweight gun slowly reveal themselves :-)

Ken

With the limits being what they are, a lite 12 should be no problem at all, but I can see a heavier gun for doves and ducks.
Its best to have both in this case.
The low recoil and pressure shells take the bite out of a light 12.

Matey, are shooting those 28gm 65mm 1400fps crazzzzzy English 'Pure Gold' loads again? You know, guality American loads a lot better, but lets keep that a secret ok?

Actually, this weekend I was usung a mixture:

Hull 65mm Imperial Game Fibre No6 28g
Gamebore 65mm Pure Gold Fibre N0.6 28g
Express 65mm HV 24g No.7 1/2

but your point about experimenting with loads is a good one.

It is hard to find a softer shooting shell than the Express 24g HV - but even that kicked the SH1T out of me in a 5lb 8os springer hammer gun I shot with a couple of weeks ago. Beautiful quality gun but I never want to shoot with it again, spiteful little beastie!

It all depends on what I am hunting, Quail behind my dogs, where i might shoot 3 to 10 times, I want my 5 to 6 pound guns. For ducks, I have a heavy Red Label with 30 inch barrels!

I fail to see the logic in shooting a 24 gram load pushed at 1300 or 1350. It would recoil like a well balanced game load with 32 grams at a slower speed. A very light 12 bore would be quite pleasant to shoot with 24 grams at about 1150 fps. That's the way I load them, but then they are admittedly hard to buy at the store. Even my favorite 6 1/4 pound Sauer ten bore is pleasant to shoot as long as I load it intelligently.

Dig - you are on track. However, the weight, balance, and handling becomes more focused when you add MOI to what you know about the gun. Keep in mind that many of us here in USA reload 7/8 oz (24 grams) of shot at 1050 - 1200 fps (5000 to 7500 psi is typical) for older and lighter weight guns.

I am in complete agreement that a shooter should develop an envelope of gun handling "dimensions" (weight, balance, swing effort unmounted, and swing effort mounted) that are suited to him as an individual.

In my neck of the woods, it's a pocket of shells for a limit, ducks or grouse, so there aren't many shots; a lighter gun is just fine. Also, the best waterfowl weather is cold and foul when heavier clothing soaks up recoil.

Dig, I think the 16ga Gamebore Traditional No. 6 felt 28g is 8122psi.

I don't know why anyone would shoot a light, light gun, though. Six and a half pounds would be the lower limit for me.