doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DIY Gunsmithing @ doublegunshop.com Stock defect identification help

What do you all make of this defect?

There does not appear to be a crack, but all I've got are these photos to go on. The gun in the photo is a Joseph Lang c.1870.

Is this something other than a grain defect?

repaired gouge would be my guess.

Thanks. I'm considering making an offer on the gun from afar, and wanted to be sure the doublegun smiths here wouldn't see this as indicative of a bigger problem like a hidden crack. Gun otherwise looks great (virtually at least)

Considering that the grain is a bit convoluted in that area, I think it is more likely that this is a small inclusion in the wood. It is most evident in your first photo, behind the popped finish, just forward of the checkering.

Inclusions are most often seen in more figured wood, and are often referred to as bark inclusions. Pitch pockets are commonly seen in pine wood. Knots sometimes emerge as a stock is carved. Often, there are no noticeable defects on a stock blank, but during turning or carving, a hidden defect will show up. Sometimes the defect is bad enough that the stock is scrapped. Some wood dealers offer a refund or exchange if a hidden inclusion or defect emerges during turning. Sometimes a small defect such as this ends up being finished and sold. Often, the stockmaker will attempt to repair or otherwise hide the defect.

Would that make you think the stock has been replaced, given that it's on a high grade Lang from the 1865-1870 era?
Would this blemish make you at all hesitant to buy a gun? I'm thinking an inclusion (or a shallow gouge) would'nt adversely affect the strength of the gun.

I haven't seen enough to make any judgement about originality of this stock. What I do see would not stop me from buying it, and I wouldn't worry about it breaking if it hasn't broken already. Without X-ray vision, no one can say if the inclusion is larger as you go deeper into the wood. But then again, any fancy grained wood might be hiding a hidden inclusion.

You might be able to use that information to get a little break on the price though.

Looks like original wood to me. A Lang of that vintage and evident quality would not have been let out the door with a stock that had an inclusion in the head of it. keith just wants to disagree with me. Buy the gun, remove the fill and repair it properly and you are good to go.

My thought on this defect was the same as your initial thought Woodreaux... a natural defect in the grain of the wood. My opinion was purely based upon what I see in your photos. My opinion has not changed. I can't help it if Stevies feelings are hurt over that. He's one of those thin-skinned sensitive little flower types.

I'd be interested though, in seeing better photos if and when you buy this gun. And if you do dig out this flaw and find it to be some badly color matched wood filler, it isn't going to hurt my feelings because I was wrong about what I see in a photo. I call 'em as I see 'em, and I'm not perfect.

Something we can finally agree upon.

You are wrong in this instance, no Lang from this period of time would have left the shop with a bark inclusion in that location.

Like I said, Stevie is one of those thin-skin sensitive flower types. And he has apparently seen every Lang shotgun that was ever built. I'm impressed.