doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Annoyed!!

And dont know what to do!!

I have a couple vintage guns I like to hunt with.

One a Model 12, and another, a Model 21.

I have used Tungsten matrix as a non tox alternative in the past.

I have read that TM will be harder and harder to find.

Bismuth is next to impossible for me to find.

What are you guys that shoot old guns doing to prepare for Hunting with Non tox?? Its inevitable that lead is on the way out!

I am also somewhat concerned about the pressures that Tm loads carry! Mostly for the 21. Do I worry to much??

Gooser

Gooser: Many share your frustration over Bismuth and TM supplies at the present, especially the waterfowlers. Of course, depending on where you hunt upland, lead is still legal. As to pressures, I think the Winchester Model 21 is just about the last classic double you need to worry about. They are tough as hell and yours should be able to handle the more reasonable off-the-shelf pressures. TT

When the fragile smallbore guns of the public upland boys are out of luck with lead, you'll get more responces.
Like to see 'em run some steel thru those light and lively little barrels eh.
The ban on lead shot was first - now no nontox!
Steel is too much for the M21.
Think there's something going on?
50,000 vintage guns would like to know.

I share your pain, because I'm down to 36 boxes.

...of what laddie?

TM not high pressure: 2 1/2-inch one ounce and 1 1/16oz at 6500 and 7500 respectively.

Bismuth 1&1/8, 1&1/4, 1&3/8oz and TM 1&3/8oz loads. The only stuff available is that green-boxed "Magnum 70" with Eley stamp. The 'Upland' Bismuth is impossible to find. With 4 to 6 cartridges per bird, gland I don't have to waste them on doves!

Every year there is talk at our D.O.W. of banning lead shot on Public Wildlife areas! Rumors from many of the Sporting clays ranges say its only a matter of time for them also!
To the common guy like me, that pretty much only gets the chance to hunt public land,, I see that as a death to my most beloved guns!
You would think that there would be a real market for someone to develop a good non tox shot other than steel, and be able to compete and stay in business!

Maybe everyone is just going to cave and purchase more modern firearms that will handle steel. I hope the man above calls time for me, and I'm not around to see it happen!

Gooser (aka Moosegooser at my regular haunts)

How do you feel about puttin' them loads up the snoot of your Sterlingworth fellas?

When you get your steel shot special in order - it'll be something else then again.
Like!
Hunting is nasty business to put on your sporting dog.
Compacting the soil of fragile landscapes.
Scares the breeding pairs of the Ruby Throated Sparrow.
It'll be something no doubt.