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Mar 28th, 2026
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 152
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 152 |
In the 1885 Purdey Catalogue on page 18 they mention a new size express rifle of .639 bore and shooting 7 to 8 drams. Advertised as a new size Express, the largest ever made. Has anyone ever heard of or seen one of these rifles?
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,369 Likes: 480
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,369 Likes: 480 |
In one of the Double Gun Journals from about 10 years ago, there was an article about a 20 bore express rifle made for an Indian Raj. It is escapes me what the fellows name was. It was a nice article. Beautiful gun.
Out there doing it best I can.
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 152
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 152 |
Thanks ClapperZapper, I have the back issues of The Double Gun Journal, will look it up.I have a 28 BORE James Purdey double rifle cased with all original accessories and mold now and used to have back in the 1970's a Holland and Holland 12 BORE underlever hammer double rifle that weighed 16 pounds and was regulated for 10 drams of blackpowder cased in almost new condition with all accessories.It was a one off experiment made for the Nawab of Bhopal. My 28 BORE takes a modified .577 Snider case and I am reworking them now. A friend of mine has a 16 BORE Holland and Holland double rifle regulated for 9 drams!I like those oddball BORE double rifles!
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 948 Likes: 2
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 948 Likes: 2 |
I handled a cased 20 bore Purdey express rifle for a long brass case about 10!years ago at an auction in San Francisco
Somewhere I have photos, I recall there having been a few things funny about the equipment in the case, and there being something about the barrel flats that looked off, but the weight of the rifle and the width of the action and the buttplate suggested that it was built for power.
GaryD I'm interested in seeing photos of your 28 bore rifle, and I'm very much interested in seeing that bullet mould.
Can you post photos?
What is the charge prescription for your rifle?
Is it engraved on the buttplate?
Cheers
Tinker
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 152
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 152 |
Hi Tinker, the 28 BORE double rifle was made in 1867 for a Viscount Downe and is marked on the butt plate for 3 drams. The powder measure is also 3 drams. It has about 70% original case colors, about 80% original brown on the barrels and the rifle locks up as new. The BEST pictures, way better than I can do are from the October 2012 James Julia Auction lot 2332. The bullet mikes .575 and the tapered bore (groove diameter) is .551 at the muzzle, as best as I can tell. I cerrosafed the chamber and the groove diameter at the beginning of the rifling is .5755, bore is .5655. Weight 9 pounds 3 ounces. The conical bullet cast from the numbered to the rifle mold is grooved and casts a hollow point bullet weighing 460 grains. Julia's listed it as a.577 Snider, but a Snider is too big. Length ok and the rim dia. and thickness and base are ok but it tapers more than a Snider. I made ten cases from .577 Sniders and used tape around the case and ran them through a .577 Nitro cut off die to get the taper then trimmed to length on a small lathe. Tinker PM me with your email address and I will get pictures of the mold.
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 948 Likes: 2
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 948 Likes: 2 |
Thanks Gary
PM with email address sent
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,369 Likes: 480
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,369 Likes: 480 |
Did you guys look up the 20 bore express rifle in the old issue of double gun journal? I was curious if the gun you’re talking about is the same one.
Out there doing it best I can.
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 948 Likes: 2
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 948 Likes: 2 |
I just found the archive for the Purdey rifle auction, but it appears as if i need to join their club in order to view theboage with the photos. If anyone here has an account with Julia Auction house and can copy/paste the image links here I'd very much appreciate it. Here's the link I landed at https://auctions.morphyauctions.com/mobile/LotDetail.aspx?inventoryid=389213
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 152
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 152 |
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 152
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 152 |
ClapperZapper, I haven't had time to look the 20 BORE up yet.I am wondering if it is an Alex Henry my brother owned and sold to Frank Findlow who wrote articles in Double Gun Journal, one of which was a 20 BORE double rifle.The Alexander Henry 20 BORE was one of 4 double rifles made for the Maharaja of Pattiala at the same time. There were two 20 BORE double rifles and two .577 double rifles. I owned one of the .577 double rifles and my brother the 20 BORE. I will look the article up after I get back from vacation. Thanks!
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,369 Likes: 480
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,369 Likes: 480 |
I believe you are correct.
Enjoy the vacation.
Out there doing it best I can.
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Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,768 Likes: 116
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,768 Likes: 116 |
I suspect that it is a .369 Purdey and the 639 is a misprint. Lagopus…..
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 152
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 152 |
I see where you are coming from but the catalog is dated 1885 and lists 6 t0 7 drams of blackpowder.
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 12,743
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 12,743 |
6 to 7 drams of black powder weighs 164-191 grains. You couldn't cram that much powder in a .50-110 Win case, full to the brim without the bullet, much less a .369. At .639" diameter, it would take 2˝" of case length to put in 7 drams of black.
Miller/TN
I Didn't Say Everything I Said, Yogi Berra
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 948 Likes: 2
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 948 Likes: 2 |
6 to 7 drams of black powder weighs 164-191 grains. You couldn't cram that much powder in a .50-110 Win case, full to the brim without the bullet, much less a .369. At .639" diameter, it would take 2˝" of case length to put in 7 drams of black. The long case 20 bore Purdey I'd seen had perhaps 3" cases I really need to find my notes and photos on that rifle
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 152
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 152 |
The 1885 copy of the Purdey catalog is in the appendix of the latest Purdey book by Dallas.
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 12,743
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 12,743 |
Tinker;
It would certainly appear that long 20 would hold that much powder & still allow seating a bullet, but try it with an approximate 92˝ gauge which is what a ,369 would be with decimals dropped to 1 place.
Miller/TN
I Didn't Say Everything I Said, Yogi Berra
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 483 Likes: 132
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 483 Likes: 132 |
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