doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com OT: rimfire and rifle caliber shell shot sizes?

My box of Winchester .44 X.L. cartridges are marked No. 8 Shot. In my 1915-16 Remington Arms - Union Metallic Cartridge Co. catalog both the .44 Winchester Shot and the .44 X.L. Shot are listed as standard with No. 8 but could be ordered with anything from No. 5 down to Dust.

Rem-UMC offered rim fire shot cartridges in .22 B.B. Cap, .22 Long, .32 Long, .38 Short, .56-50 Spencer and .41 Swiss. In central fire they offered .32 Smith and Wesson; .32 Long Colt; .32 Winchester; .38 Smith and Wesson; .38 Long Colt; .44 Smith and Wesson, Russian; .44 Winchester; .44 Marble Game Getter; .44 X.L.; .38-55 Winchester, Marlin and Savage; .45-70 Government; 11 M-M Mauser and .43 Egyptian.

I used to have a 6" barreled Ruger .22/.22WMR Single-Six, before it was stolen out of my pickup. I carried .22 Mag shot cartridges in it when in rattler or cottonmouth stomping grounds, and it was very good on them. When shot in the head/neck area they don't thrash about, usually. They just flinch a bit, start bleeding from the little holes, and die.



One is not always walking when one encounters a cottonmouth or rattler. Sometimes one is in a paddle boat with overhead limbs, where they like to lay in the sun. When frightened as one passes underneath, said snake will often drop off the limb and land right in the boat at your feet. Not a good scenario. No. 12 shot will imbed in the wood, but not make a leaking hole in it, and it will do the deal on a big cottonmouth at 3 feet. And, don't even say that a canebrake won't get wet or sun on a limb over water. I've had big cottonmouths to try their best to get into the boat with me, when swimming. Why, I haven't a clue.................. Okefenokee Joe says they are not aggressive. Maybe I just mistake their intentions when they clearly see me and come towards me very fast. Perhaps they're just coming over to say hello...............at handshaking distance.

SRH

Up here in the northeast, I've been known to get out of my truck and remove snakes from the road to prevent them from being killed. Especially, the snakes who consume rodents - they are very helpful when the woods are infested with chipmunks. That said, during the time I spent in Georgia, I never saw any shortage of cottonmouths. In fact, I would say it was quite the opposite. The way I see it, if a poisonous snake puts a man's well-being in danger, it does not seem inappropriate for a man to defend himself. Just my thoughts on the subject...

I live in town. But I have a fish pond in my backyard and big trees and shrubbery. I've never had a poisonous snake, but surprisingly have a good many Gray Rat Snakes and water snakes in the pond, mostly Banded or Red-bellied Water Snakes.

I've raised five children in this home, three of them boys. Once
the boys killed a Banded Water Snake with a bow and arrow. I took that opportunity to explain to them the value of the snakes we have and my own personal ethic about snake killing. Teaching the boys to turkey hunt we've run across lots of Moccasins and Rattlers. We walk around them unless they get scary; then they're dead.

While I appreciate the non-poisonous snakes I will not have the bad guys around my home. However, like I said I live in town and have never seen any of the poison varieties in the yard...Geo

One of our local Churches has an annual "Wild Game Cookout", and fried rattlesnake is one of the most popular items. In Alabama all snakes are protected, except the venomous ones. Snakes eat rats(mice) and I hate rats.
Mike

In Tennessee the Venomous ones are protected too. Several years back a good friend of mine who was working as a Deputy Sheriff killed a rattlesnake on a public beach. Someone took a picture of it & sent it to the local Newspaper. A few days later a TWRA agent showed up at his house. He explained it was on a public beach which was full of young people & got off with a "Warning". He told me under the same circumstances he would do the same thing again BUT he would make certain no one took a picture.

Researcher and all, thanks for the info. Someday soon I'm gonna try to make up some .44XL shotshells and try my Stevens 101 out on cottontails with a little load of 4s or 5s. I've fired it with single.427 roundballs and seen no danger signs. It dates from the smokeless powder era and is chokeless.

I only mess with poisonous snakes when they are in areas frequented by lots of kids and dogs. We have LOTS of rattlesnakes here but they are really very unaggressive. You just need to know where they are and where your hands and feet are and make SURE they are not the in same place. And keep your kids and dogs under strict control (not a bad idea anyway). I shoot snakes when they get into or under buildings, including but not limited to outhouses.

Cottonmouths scare me, but then I'm a squeamish Yankee....

Mike A.
My cousin has a Stevens in 44XL, and I gave him some 7x57R cases for his loads. Cut to length, they worked well, 8x57R would work also. I had some shot loads based on 30-40 cases that worked OK, but were smaller in diameter. I think he used #8 shot, but don't remember powder load. He closed them off with a card wad and waterglass. You could also use Titebond.
Mike

I've never seen a rattler that would not leave the vicinity of a human if he had the chance and felt threatened. Cottonmouths are a whole different thing.

We were once gigging bullfrogs in a pond of ours at night, in a paddle boat. We came around a little point of land and there was a very healthy canebrake rattler in a coil .............floating in about 6 ft. of water, about 5 yards out from the bank. Never saw that before or since. I was shining and paddling and my bud was gigging. He stuck that big rattler with that gig before I knew what he was doing. Said rattler was most unhappy about the situation. Can't say I blamed him.

I go out of my way to leave them alone if they are away from where people work or inhabit. They've got a tough life. But, I make no apologies for killing rattlers and cottonmouths where they are near people.

SRH

Mike, Thanks for the tips. I'll have my eyes open for European rimmed Mauser style ctg. cases at the next big gunshow I attend. Won't need many. Or I may just advertise for some in various gun-related WTB sites. SOMEBODY must shoot 'em and not reload....