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According to a letter I received from V-C, they patented the Helice system in the early 20th century (no exact date provided). "Helice Grip" was patented as one of their trademarks in 1907. So it could go back that far.

Where is Argo44? Bill Harriman gives it was in 1904?

"The Verney Carron Helice shotgun was first designed in 1904. The name Helice refers to the screw thread-like system, which formed the third locking point on the action.
Read more at http://www.shootinguk.co.uk/answers/can-you-tell-me-about-my-verney-carron-16-bore-helice-shotgun-25163#O1I17hbPmiu2XABl.99"

http://www.shootinguk.co.uk/answers/can-...e-shotgun-25163

Cheers,

Raimey
rse

Could be 1904 if this cat is the real deal:

"Sorry, the first part of message has gone away and disappeared!so after you read part 2, I am going to rewrite part 1 :
'Helice' stands for 'Helicoidal', since the lever is helicoidal. You can find guns from France and in particular from Saint-Etienne with 'Helice gripp' or 'Helice grip'or 'Helice block'. Those systems were patented. Many of the guns produced by my family have 'Helice gripp' engraved on the top lever.I also found out that Verney-Carron in 1904 developped the Helice grip system as a variation of the 'Webley-4 locks system'.
Not beeing a technician, I have dificulties to translate the info I have got. Anyway, British amateurs can be proud: William Anson invented the top-lever! A. Rousson was one of the first M.O.F. which means Meilleur Ouvrier de France(the best worker in his specialty when industry and art meet).now you can read the previous message , hope it makes sense
Cheers
M.Maisonnial"

https://www.internetgunclub.com/archived-forum/posts.php?topicid=722

Cheers,

Raimey
rse

have come to conclusion that lighter early gun, 5 1/2 pounds, is pre ww1...later heavier gun, 5 3/4 pounds, is post ww1...which, begs the question, how come french 16's are so light weight and so many others are so heavy?

answer is, only the french can produce such light weight delights, such as, bardot, beaujolais and souffle...

I'm here. We've talked several times about VC and the patent filed by him under at least three names and its relationship to the generic "helice" found on dozens of French keys. I've photos of about 45 keys with this on them for comparison and will make a montage at some point for reference. But Ed knows how to post photos so until he does, let's sit on our hands (as Botvinnik advised a young chess player when I was just starting to pay chess in the early 1950's).

Per the 1922 V-C catalog (several years after the invention and patent of the Helice system by V-C), the only two copyrighted names they were using that included some form of "Helice" were: "Helice Grip" and "HelicoBloc". However, other forms of "Helice" were later used by V-C. For example, I owned a V-C 16ga with "Helice 33" on the top lever (the 33 indicating the year of the gun's introduction). That was apparently the first V-C double on which the traditional flat leaf springs were replaced with "rust-resistant" coil springs. That according to the pages from the contemporary catalog I received from V-C when I inquired about my Helice 33.

did vc resume production of 16 ga sxs guns after ww2?

"... only the french can produce such light weight delights, such as, bardot, beaujolais and souffle..." Ed Good

That's a keeper...Geo