doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Swedish full chokes

For the vast majority condemnation of full choke guns are warranted & fully justified. Light chokes up to about 1/4 choke (around .010" in 12 gauge) are not in the same league as full & can make for a very versatile gun, much more useful than a cylinder bore. In spite of McIntosh's vast experience I am not in agreement with his statement on the obsolesce of "Any" choke.
Some of the best shooting I ever did on both quail & the occasional woodcock which sometimes stopped over in my area was done with a 28" barreled 12 gauge double bored with .010" choke in both barrels. I was loading 1 oz #8 shot @ about 8K psi to around 1125-1150 fps velocity for the Damascus barrels. I did not find it particularly mangling at any reasonable range, nor did I find it significantly more difficult to hit with than a cyl bore. As stated though it was a lot more versatile gun than a cyl bore. Just my limited experience, but I love those light choked guns.

Ducks and geese do not die reliably with open chokes unless they are in your face over decoys. I want no open chokes when I intend to kill a turkey.

Most other wingshooting however, even on educated fully feathered doves is done better (for me) with IC and Mod chokes. First season doves and woodcock is cyl or IC territory.

Those who shoot better than I do like more choke. They rightfully figure that any part of the shot charge lying outside the perimeter of the target is wasted because they ordinarily center the pattern on whatever they're shooting at. I, on the other hand have always relied upon the kindness of pattern edges, so I prefer wider edges...Geo

Nice "Streetcar" paraphrase there, George. Well done.

King, I emailed M. McIntosh about that same statement he wrote, and explained why I thought he was wrong. He never even replied to me. I still think he wrote that to "stir the pot". I cannot believe he believed that. Also, I have a problem with the term "upland". It seems to denote, in most articles I read, grouse, pheasant, woodcock and quail. How about doves and turkeys? They are upland birds, too, and need choke to be shot well.

I am a very strong proponent of choke, in many situations. I tend to overdo choke in some instances, I guess. I have very little use, or need, for cylinder. I will admit that I struggle with woodcock, and that may be a situation where I could utilize a cylinder barrel for the first shot. I am a bit more of a deliberate shooter than a snap shooter, and when forced to snap shoot (read woodcock), I don't perform well. If I get the chance to try them again this season I intend to try a cylinder barrel on the first shot and see if it helps me any. I'm fine with quail, even though they fly fast on the flush, without snap shooting. But, they tend to fly in a more or less straight line. Woodcock don't know what straight means.

Many hunters that I see would be well served with a cylinder barrel, but they would still hopelessly send "Hail Marys" after the first miss, so I dunno. What I do know for dead certain is that, when I got serious about sporting clays, I did not improve at the pace I thought I should until I started shooting modified fixed chokes all the time. That made a much better shooter out of me. But, there again, woodcock ain't sporting clays.

SRH

Thank you for your post, Stan. To me, it's 24-caret gold, confirming my suspicions. Except for a cyl/f Parker hammer 16 0 grade, all my fixed-choke and insert guns are IC/M. As a football player, 40-yard limits are taped to my heart.

The Parker sort of ruined it for my son on his first shoot. A crossing black way outside the tollers, I was going to say too far, and he dropped it stone dead first shot from the blind. He never went gunning again; maybe too easy. I couldn't convince him otherwise.

I freely admit I have not shot near as many patterns as I should have over the years. However I have observed many pattern tests performed by & reported on by the American
Rifleman staff over the years. They have habitually used an 8 field target using a 21.2" inner circle (Half Diameter) inside the normal 30" circle. Observation has shown that increases in choke brings a higher % of the shot into the inner circle but with little change in the outer rim. The entire pattern is reduced in size with shot outside the 30" circle (totaly useless) being brought inside, while many in the outer rim are shifted into the inner circle. End result is a denser inner circle with little actual change of pellet count in the outer rim.

This will give you a longer range for a well centered hit, but precious little advantage on a hit outside that inner circle. I am thoroughly convinced this is why I saw no significant advantage to a cyl bore over the .010" choke of the gun I mentioned on either quail, woodcock or rabbits for which I used the same load with #6 shot substituted. This gun is quick to point, but with just enough weight & forward balance to swing smooth. It was pure poison on a rabbit coming across a clearing with his ears laying back which occurs from the air drag when he is really moving to gain distance from the pack of beagles pursuing him.