doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Shot Distribution in Pattern

I have Journee's book. Unfortunately, to my knowledge, it's never been translated. At one time, I gave brief thought to translating at least parts of it. Quickly discovered that while my "gun French" is decent, Journee is way too technical for me.

So what is breaking the target or killing the bird, how the shot string flies through the air or what pattern it produces when it hits a flat surface at forty yards?

So we are taking something that is three dimensional as it flies through the air and making it one dimensional as it hits a flat surface? Does that tell us anything other than how POA differs from POI?

No, we're making it two dimensional.

Absolutely. A two dimensional pattern on a plate is an exact representation of what will strike, or miss, a straightaway bird or a dead straight incomer, or a turkey's head/neck. And it comes pretty darn close on a quartering bird, seeing as how the bird can only move a very small amount during the time it takes the entire shot string to pass it.

SRH

I don't read French, so , obviously, I haven't read Journee. I have paid attention to what others have said he said. If correct, his theory of inward momentum doesn't fly. It doesn't work that way. Choke is a fluid dynamics issue, not mechanics.

Do translate it, Larry.

DDA

+1 Well said, Stan.

DDA

Perhaps this is a little tangential, but what does a 0.030" choke constriction do in a 0.730" barrel that a O.000" choke would do in a 0.700" barrel?

There is something more than simply constricting the diameter while increasing the length of the shot column that is going on because these two hypothetical barrels would pattern quite differently, no?

Is there a simple, consensus explanation?

Rocketman -

your comments reach the level of absurd. Crowds POUR into the stadium as well but I suspect that the motion post-entrance choke is Brownian.

It is unfortunate that you are not capable of understanding that choke effect is nothing more than the resolution of vector forces within a collection of interacting bodies which are subjected to a variety of external (and resultant internal as well) forces varying in both direction and intensity. This could not be simpler in concept tho admittedly complex in regard to the number of bodies and variant forces. I'm sure that with today's computational forces it would be NBD to mathematically model and display it as a nice slo-mo vidi so you could actually see it happen. You may scale that in any way that you like, micro or macro, but it remains nothing more than a 3-dimensional pooltable-like vector analysis. And you can call it fluid all you like and it still is a simple vector resolution of interacting bodies.
BTW all that "semi"fluid is of course a misnomer as it is actually "quasi" or more properly "pseudo" if you feel absolutely compelled to insist on that ridiculous reference.

That's it for me. I don't know any other way to attempt to convey the physical reality of this choke thing.

So, thanks for playing - - - I'm off to practice my fire-hose clay target technique. I'm sure my new appreciation of shot column fluid dynamics will be of some great assistance.

It gives .030" more constriction. .000" is cylinder, and really is no choke at all. Remember, the amount of choke is the difference between the bore measurement, just before constriction begins, and the smallest i.d. at the muzzle.

SRH

Yes, I know, but the shot column exiting the barrels would be the same, no? So, why is one a "cylinder choke" and the other a "light full"?

Why is it that constriction matters more than diameter?

Constriction is the only way to "choke down" the diameter of the shot column, and to work, it has to happen at, or very near the muzzle. This reduction of diameter at the muzzle is what provides the choke effect...... the reduction, regardless of bore diameter.

SRH