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6 members (shrapnel, KDGJ, Argo44, MattH, LGF, Birdog),
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Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 5,047 Likes: 412
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 5,047 Likes: 412 |
The gun and marks have something of a Scandinavian look to them, this is outside my limited expertise.
Mike
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,575 Likes: 182
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,575 Likes: 182 |
That's a stumper, for sure. The PF under a crown likely indicates proof with smokeless powder. Maybe a specific type of early bulk smokeless, although F was not among the several types of smokeless initially used in French proof.
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,897 Likes: 666
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,897 Likes: 666 |
Your gun seems to predate most proof houses. Some countries started proofing guns earlier than others. Some countries started proofing earlier to keep cheaper, weaker guns out so their makers did not have to compete. It was always cloaked as a safety measure, and it was. But while British guns were proofed in the early 1800's other countries might not start until 1890's. Some makers had their own marks as well as interim proof marks.
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 12,608 Likes: 504
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 12,608 Likes: 504 |
The tubes or tubeset were undoubtedly sourced from Sauer. Touchmarks are unlike any Danish marks I've viewed. I'm leaning toward early Italian.
Cheers,
Raimey
rse
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 12,073 Likes: 841
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 12,073 Likes: 841 |
I don't believe the gun in question is too old to predate most proof houses. It has top lever opening, choke boring, and Krupp fluid steel barrels.
The NRA has proven itself unreliable and corrupt.
Period.
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Joined: Jan 2002
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 10,427 Likes: 168 |
keet: on this we can agree...
keep it simple and keep it safe...
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Joined: Aug 2007
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 12,608 Likes: 504 |
The maker's mark on the flats looks to be a Rampant Lion in a shield?
Cheers,
Raimey
rse
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Joined: Oct 2009
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 6,757 Likes: 714 |
I asked Raimey about these marks last week and got the early Italian thought. Like some others I thought it had a bit of a Germanic look but with no sign of a mark that shows up in the Standard Directory, from any country, I have concluded Raimey is probably on the right track.
The world cries out for such: he is needed & needed badly- the man who can carry a message to Garcia
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 12,608 Likes: 504
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 12,608 Likes: 504 |
Yeah, a shot in the dark for sure but it is #5 by some maker that used the Rampant Lion in a shield as a trademark & I for one would guess the other marks are not actual proofhouse marks but internal process / proofmarks by the maker, although the possibility exits that it passed thru some odd proofhouse under our radar. I also agree w/ Mr. Brown that the PF surmounted by a crown is for Polvere / Poudre / Powder / Pulver, etc. paired w/ the F. Remote possibility that there are marks on the back sides of the locks or on the hidden portion the frame. But again, the tubeset was sourced directly from Sauer. I do fancy how the tubes were struck to leave a little extra metal for reinforcement, which is hidden by the adornment.
Cheers,
Raimey
rse
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 2,080 Likes: 79
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 2,080 Likes: 79 |
Deleted
Last edited by old colonel; 04/27/17 12:23 AM.
Michael Dittamo
Topeka, KS
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