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Forums10
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Jul 28th, 2025
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 9,409 Likes: 4
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 9,409 Likes: 4 |
Beretta only dominates the vertical half of the doublegun market. They never have, and never will, dominate the horizontal half. Yes PB is company in business to make a profit. They aren't going to dominate market that essentially does not exist. The English boutique shops cater like they always had to those with disposable income and time to enjoy shooting sports. From historical point of view in USA guns were a necessity often used to feed families. They went into the bushes shot twice and almost always ate what they shot not so in Great Britain. They almost never ate what they shot and had game chased to them by peasants waving arms and making noise. The wealthy US tycoons came later in USA than England took passenger liners to England and bought their guns there, no?
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 9,409 Likes: 4
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 9,409 Likes: 4 |
They filled a void left open by the English gun makers....
What always puzzled me at my gun club was every time you look around someone is having trouble out of their Perrazi yet the following remains. Image. In certain niches of our society it matters what you eat, wear and use.
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,710 Likes: 346
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,710 Likes: 346 |
Would you say that the demand for low price basic models had taken the lions share of the sales during the 20th century ?
To draw a parallel, the firm who could make an ever lasting stay sharp razor blade would probably only sell one to each person who needed one . What would they do then ?.... I think all of the great British makers just could not figure out how to stay in the general market, so they generally moved to niche markets. Chances are, Beretta's longevity and strength is in their ability to react and diversify.
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,281 Likes: 12
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,281 Likes: 12 |
What always puzzled me at my gun club was every time you look around someone is having trouble out of their Perrazi yet the following remains. People who contend that the Italians can't make game guns clearly do not have a clue. I refer you to Nobili's books for elucidation and enlightenment. And as a whole, the current crop of Italian engravers would be difficult to fault for either execution or originality. That is not to say that they are unique for there are obviously many American, for example, engravers of incredible skill, etc. As to the fragility of Perazzis. Contentions to that effect are as well clearly made by those who don't have a clue. The Perazzi MX based series was designed as a competition gun and not adapted form anything else, pure and simple - with the emphasis on simple. Which is also its curse since it is so simple any meathead can take a look at it and think - nothing to it, I can fix that. Which of course is not only just stupid but wrong as well. Simple does not mean imprecise and precision demands expertise. Elite competition shooters worldwide rely on Perazzis not only for medals but massive purses. Personally it seems contradictory that a gun that breaks down incessantly would be their choice. The problematic Perazzis that I have seen were in the hands of people that had absolutely no business having them. Over the course of the last nearly three decades and a number of Perazzis I have had to replace one broken firing pin and one broken hammer spring. For some while my wife and I were putting +/- 500 rounds a week thru the things and I still shoot 200-300 a week. So a modest estimate of 10K/yr for 30 years. Make of that what you will. prolly not JMO
Last edited by Wonko the Sane; 03/25/17 11:55 AM.
Dr.WtS
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 159
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 159 |
Interesting that in the discussion no one cares to discuss the McKinley tariff intent and impacts.
Jeremy
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 9,409 Likes: 4
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 9,409 Likes: 4 |
What always puzzled me at my gun club was every time you look around someone is having trouble out of their Perrazi yet the following remains. People who contend that the Italians can't make game guns clearly do not have a clue. I refer you to Nobili's books for elucidation and enlightenment. And as a whole, the current crop of Italian engravers would be difficult to fault for either execution or originality. That is not to say that they are unique for there are obviously many American, for example, engravers of incredible skill, etc. As to the fragility of Perazzis. Contentions to that effect are as well clearly made by those who don't have a clue. The Perazzi MX based series was designed as a competition gun and not adapted form anything else, pure and simple - with the emphasis on simple. Which is also its curse since it is so simple any meathead can take a look at it and think - nothing to it, I can fix that. Which of course is not only just stupid but wrong as well. Simple does not mean imprecise and precision demands expertise. Elite competition shooters worldwide rely on Perazzis not only for medals but massive purses. Personally it seems contradictory that a gun that breaks down incessantly would be their choice. The problematic Perazzis that I have seen were in the hands of people that had absolutely no business having them. Over the course of the last nearly three decades and a number of Perazzis I have had to replace one broken firing pin and one broken hammer spring. For some while my wife and I were putting +/- 500 rounds a week thru the things and I still shoot 200-300 a week. So a modest estimate of 10K/yr for 30 years. Make of that what you will. prolly not JMO I thank you for what you said. I love Italians. They are warm, kind and generous people from place with old and interesting history. It makes me very happy when I buy Italian shoes, shirt, noodles, spaghetti sauce,.....
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 709
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 709 |
Hey wonk! Perazzis are great but out of reach for many of us. Is there a gun sort of like a Perazzi but much cheaper?
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 9,409 Likes: 4
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 9,409 Likes: 4 |
Hey wonk! Perazzis are great but out of reach for many of us. Is there a gun sort of like a Perazzi but much cheaper? Vostok MU-8. Those can still be found in very good to excellent condition. This is important because they haven't been made in many years so parts are likely made of unobtainium.
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,109 Likes: 78
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,109 Likes: 78 |
I first started to see the Beretta 680 guns in volume as trap guns in the early 80's.
The saying was 'good gun for the money'.
That's the key to their success even today.
Beretta sells these by the boatload, due to price/value. Simple as that.
I've seen 3 of the 680 series guns break a hammer, one of them was my 1985 vintage S682X trap gun at about the 50,000 target mark. Rich Cole sent me a hammer, and it dropped right in.
The Italian gun makers certainly have a long proud history, but they tooled up for CNC volume production at just the right time with sound and serviceable designs.
I currently have 5 PB's including 2 of their excellent automatics, and I can keep them running without 'returning them to the maker'.
I'm unaware of any Brit guns that were ever made in volume for a really mass market. The 'copies' like the Ithaca SKB and the Spanish H&H clones likely sold more units than the originals. It's just a whole different world, and I'm not well enough funded to participate.
For a very nice SxS Italian made gun, look at B. Rizzini.
"The price of good shotgunnery is constant practice" - Fred Kimble
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 14,013 Likes: 1817
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 14,013 Likes: 1817 |
There are several good O/Us that are made with similarities to the Perazzi, but they ain't Perazzis. I've shot them all, I think, and nothing, but nothing handles and shoots like the the original. A Google search will bring up the brands that share similarities with the Perazzi.
Actually, the gun that is the closest to feeling like my MX8 is the 32" Beretta 682 Gold E.
SRH
Last edited by Stan; 03/25/17 10:08 PM.
May God bless America and those who defend her.
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