doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com DUmagazine article FUBAR

Just got my March/April 2016 and read, with great disgust-page 47-- Field and Stream shotgunning iditor- Phil Bourjaily's article on putting lipstick-camo on a pig- older Remmie 870- gun had no rattle-no shine as it was, but if he wants to re-invent the wheel, that's his call. What jerks my chain big-time is in his sidebar- and I quote: "Incidentally, adding a Simmons rib to a Winchester Model 12 is among the rare instances in which an aftermarket addition improves the value of the gun" Bull Shit- what kind of wacky weed is this Iowa schmuck smoking- I own 9 older Model 12's ranging from a Model 1912 circa 1917 to a 3" Mag Heavy duck with 32" solid rib barrel circa 1949- none of mine were made after 1954--and I'll stick my pecker in a porcupines' nest before I would EVER have Simmons screw with any of them--WTF is this nut-case thinking.? The only Model 12 I own with a ventilated rib is a 1948 era 12 gauge pigeon grade Trap- with the "older milled rib" 30" Full-a few of the others, including a 28 gauge, have solid ribs- the rest are plain barreled-

Any time you offer a non-factory, or altered Model 12 for sale to any serious collector, you can expect a real shit-storm of criticism about any non-factory or custom shop alterations. When WRA went to the cheaper soldered on the barrel posts New Rib circa 1952--and deleted the older milled rib with the duckbill extension, they opened the door to out-of-round condition barrels- ditto the soldered on after-market support posts of the Simmons-

Time for DU to fire another "columnist" as they did E. Donnall Thomas--

Sticking your d--k in a porcupine does seem a little rash. Might want to think this one through. Wouldn't want to hurt another porcupine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EWtgTfDFTuE

How many of these Model 12's did they make anyway?

If you start in 1912- when the Model 1912 first came out in 20 gauge- 2.5" chambers, 25" plain barrel- retailing at $25.00, and go to late 1964 when WRA dropped the Model 12- about 1,900,000 ball figure from production in all grades, gauges and variations, including Custom Shop M12's-- this does NOT include the M42- the red-haired step-brother of the M12, in the midget bore- .410-- OK for skeet, expert shots only, but as worthless as tits on a rain-barrel for clean kills on upland game birds like pheasants and grouse and Hungarian partridge--maybe OK for quail and woodcock, but I am not sure even about that.

I'm no fan of modified Winchesters (unless it's a basket case project, & even then I'd have my limits). Mr. Fox, what you're seeing is a much younger crowd coming-on that doesn't understand the history of the M12 (a high percentage of the millennials I interact with are almost abjectly....historically illiterate), is unlikely to ever be any form of a collector of such things, and is merely singing the eternal song of the "gun-writer", which is to shill for the goods and services of their advertisers.

I agree, and thank you for the insightful analysis. Just as I fail to grasp the concept of the term "metro-sexual", what is, pray tell- a millenial? A Yuppie perhaps? I am almost 75, and I'll bet you a bunch I would relate to them about as well as Hillary Clinton would warm up to Monica Lewinsky at a cocktail party!! RWTF..

Winchester sold new Mod 12s with ribs by Simmons, so it's not really that big a deal to add one to an old beater. A friend found a thrashed and trashed 20ga Mod 12 and sent it to Simmons a few years ago for a full redo, including new rib and new wood. The original gun was a complete beater and the redo was money well spent. It's a shooter, and he'll have it for a long time.

There's so many of them running around for sale and Winchester offered Simmons ribs on new guns. It may not increase the value but I can't see where that aftermarket addition would reduce the asking price, either.

Maybe so, so, but an original 1919 patent raised ventilated rib on a Model 12, worth waay more than a later one installed by Simmons in Olathe, KS--

RTF, he's talking about "adding a Simmons rib", not taking off an original and replacing it. So he's talking about a plain barrel Mod 12 vs one with a Simmons, not original VR versus Simmons rib. And I expect most everyone here would agree that adding any kind of a rib to a really pristine Model 12 isn't a good idea in terms of what it would do to the value. But on one that's your basic "shooter" with some wear . . .

If he did that to an original 1919 Model 12 then the owner of said Model 12 should be given a second class trail and a first class hanging.