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3 members (canvasback, 2 invisible),
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Key:
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Forums10
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Most Online9,918
Jul 28th, 2025
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,859
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,859 |
The good news is, it's easy to tell a good gun from a crap gun no matter where it's made just upon inspection.
Steve
Approach life like you do a yellow light - RUN IT! (Gail T.)
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 12,743
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 12,743 |
I have a ratty old 12 ga hammer double with Birmingham proof marks which predate 1887. It is back action with a side (left) lever opener. Lock plates are marked W Richards. Top rib says W Richards London Laminated Steel. Though it does appear as if was originally a cut above the Belgian W richards guns it is by no means either a Westly Or William Richards. Clabrough may have made it, but it is certainly not the quality of my Clabrough sidelock hammerless & even this one from a catalog I have seen of a close era was near the bottom of the Clabrough line.
Having Birmingham proofs does not automatically make a gun of high quality or from a well known reputable maker. Likewise having Belgian proofs does not automatically make a gun Junk, though I think most guns marked W Richards with Belgian proofs likely are.
Rocdoc/Steve summed it up in his above post. If one can't tell the difference between the normal W Richards & either a William or Westly then they aren't very observant of anything but the name.
Miller/TN
I Didn't Say Everything I Said, Yogi Berra
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Joined: May 2012
Posts: 31
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 31 |
Having personally never handled either of these guns, how can anyone be expected to know from photos only? If the photos are clear and properly lighted etc it might be easier. I thought this was a place to gain knowledge and exchange information and ideas. Maybe a few comments about my powers of observation weren't truly meant to be condescending but they sure seemed to be.
Dave Myrick
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2002
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Dave, my comments were absolutely not meant to be condescending, please accept my apologies. Once you learn more about double guns you'll understand, the quality, or lack of quality, will jump right out at you, even in photographs. Please bear with he folks here, there's almost no one here who'll try to offend you on purpose.
Steve
Approach life like you do a yellow light - RUN IT! (Gail T.)
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Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 928 Likes: 42
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 928 Likes: 42 |
Dave,
Stick around, lots of good people here. Almost everyone is VERY helpful.
Bill
Bill Johnson
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 1,071
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 1,071 |
Welcome Dave. Yes, please stick around. There is a wealth of knowledge on this forum. I have been helped many times. The problem with the net is that sometimes it is difficult to interpret how the written word was meant to be received.
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,759 Likes: 460
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,759 Likes: 460 |
Belgian W. Richards side-cocker  Belgian H&D Folsom import W. Richards Norwich, Conn.  W. Richard Belgium by Louis Muller, who may have been in the employ of Folsom as he registered the Crescent trademarks in Belgium until 1914.  A. Richard  W. Richards, (probably Liverpool) with Birmingham proof http://www.wrichardsguns.co.uk/history.html 
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,759 Likes: 460
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,759 Likes: 460 |
RicKARD  
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Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,768 Likes: 115
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,768 Likes: 115 |
Nice photos Drew and really illustrate the issue. I think I could spot the difference between a W. Richards (Belgian)and a W. Richards (Liverpool) at twenty paces. W. Richards (Liverpool) is still in business but now located at Pocklington, Yorkshire. Lagopus.....
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,759 Likes: 460
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,759 Likes: 460 |
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