doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Help Identifying WW Greener Hammer Gun

Greetings all,

I was hoping some of the knowledgeable individuals on here could help me identify a shotgun I picked up yesterday at a gun show in Spartanburg, SC. Any help whatsoever would be greatly appreciated.

First, I know Graham Greener is helpful in identifying these from the original manufacturer's records. However, I could not locate his contact info so I thought I would start here.

The gun in question has hammers, an engraved receiver, prince of wales grip stock with steel butt plate, what appear to be Damascus barrels and a S/N in the 21XXX range (I believe that makes it an 1879?).

The barrels have mirror bores. I realize honing is a possibility. I intend to have wall thickness measured prior to doing anything with the gun. After reviewing "Vintage Guns", the barrels appear to be English Laminated Steel.

Here is a link to a bunch of pictures:

http://s304.photobucket.com/user/djangofandango/library/?sort=3&evt=email_share_media&page=1

I would appreciate any information anyone has on this gun that they would be willing to share.

Best,

Dan

Nice looking gun. According to Graham Greener's book "the Greener Story" your gun was made 1879 or 1880.

Very nice looking gun. I believe it is from 1880, and is in what Greener called the First Grading System, Best, Medium and Inexpensive. With the engraving on your gun it is still hard to find what it is graded at. I do not see a ross bolt on this one.

Hopefully Raimey will see this and add is knowledge.

Thanks guys. Also, I paid $600, it seemed like too good a price to pass up given that it is rare these days to find anything with an asking price sub 1K at gun shows, particularly a nice English double. I figured it has to be worth close to that even if just a wall hanger. If anyone has any rough idea of value, I would be interested to hear that as well.

The gun shows very good wood to metal fit in the pictures that show that. Assuming the metal to metal fit is as good, this is a great gun. The Treble Wedge Fast locking mechanism precedes the date of this gun, so this gun may be less than best grade. No matter, condition is much more important than the place of the gun in the Greener grading system.

eightbore, the barrels are fairly tight on the action with only the slightest bit of play with the forend off. Otherwise, every thing seems very tight with proper clearances. Again, due to the age of the gun, I am going to have it professionally checked out. I will most likely take it up to Bill Schwarz in Elijay, GA to have it thoroughly looked over (unless I can find someone a bit closer in Atlanta). He did some work on an LC Smith I owned and I was very happy with it.

Also, as mentioned previously, the bores are mirror clean. Hopefully, not as a result of honing though. It just appears to be an original but used gun in good overall condition.

$600 is an awesome price...good one...I love Greeners
franc

BTW, it is unclear whether the gun is a 10 or 12 bore very similar to what was going on in this post:

http://www.doublegunshop.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=334170

The barrels are marked 12B and 13M (seemingly indicating a 12 bore), but a modern 12 gauge shell seems loose in the chamber (although it does seat properly).

Does anyone know anything about "oversize" 12 bore Greeners from this era?

Update:

By way of confirmation from Graham Greener (consistent with the barrel markings) the gun originally left the manufacturer as a 12 bore and was made in 1879.

I took it to Bill Schwarz in Ellijay, GA yesterday and he measured the chambers and wall thickness. The chambers are now 2 7/8 and 10 gauge shell dimensions. Min wall thickness left barrel 30 thou, right barrel 35 thou. There are no other visible issues, faults with the barrels, receiver, action, etc. Bores are mirror bright. The gun is on face, but has a slight bit of play between the barrels and the action. He said the steel looked to be very high grade Damascus/Laminated Steel and in excellent condition. He suggested it would be safe to shoot with low pressure 10 gauge loads.

It is hard to believe the gun left Greener with that much material in the barrels, but I am quite grateful that it did

The 13M indicates muzzle diameter or choke. I'd get that top lever screw timed.

With that done I'd say it would have a value of $1000.00 to $1500.00 depending on who was buying or selling.