Kyrie, again you're talking what happens NOW with driven hunts, not what happened "back in the day", when Brits like Ripon were recording hundreds of thousands of dead birds in their game books.
No Larry, I have clearly been talking about both now and pre-civil war Spain.
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Kyrie, you have a very extensive collection of Spanish guns. How many of them date from before WWII?
Several.
Any date from before WWI?
Yes.
Personally, I've seen darned few pre-WWII Spanish guns, and I don't believe I've ever seen one made prior to WWI. Meanwhile, there are any number of folks here shooting British guns that were made 40 years or more prior to WWI. And some of them saw extensive use in driven shoots. Can you come up with any Spanish examples from that era that have seen similar use?
Yes. And the Spanish guns would still pass current C.I.P. proof. Did you follow the earlier thread about all the British guns failing proof now that the British proof houses have begun to actually implement C.I.P. proof? How many of those pre-WWII (much less pre-WWI) guns do you think would actually pass proof today?
Guns that go back to the black powder/early nitro/corrosive primer era? Shotshell technology, modern steel vs pre-WWI steel . . . details like that make a significant difference in how long a gun is likely to survive under hard use, especially with minimal "preventive maintenance". You have maybe a 125 year old Spanish gun you can compare to a British gun of similar age? If not, then you don't have one that was used under anything approaching similar conditions.
Utter nonsense. Without two equally complete and detailed 125 year long records of use you have no idea what conditions two guns experienced and no hope of comparing the two guns. I have a very few guns where I've talked with descendents of the original owner and know quite a bit about what it was used for and how much of that use the guns had. Without that kind of provenance you have little idea what, if any use a gun has had or whether any gun I have had less, similar, or more use.
As for Spanish guns not being copies of British guns: The Spanish don't make A&D boxlocks? Holland-pattern sidelocks?
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Irrelevant. The subject was British light game guns, which are defined by their relative light weight for their chambering. These are typically SxS guns chambered for the 12 gauge, 2.75 inch shell and weighing no more than 6.75 pounds, or chambered for the 2.5 inch 12 gauge shell and weighing no more than 6.5 pounds, or chamber for the 2 inch 12 gauge shell and weighing no more than 6.25 pounds. Type of action isnt a part of the definition and doesnt matter.
Spanish gun makers (especially AyA) can and do make light game guns for the English trade, but the thats small change to their bread and butter gun, which is a European medium game gun (an approximately seven pound 12 gauge with 2.75 inch chambers). The demand for British light game guns is tiny, and only AyA has bothered to cater to it.
