doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Vouzelaud

Because you're either too simple to understand the concept of "context" or too intent on twisting stuff to try and make a point.

OWD

I think Ted brings up good points, doesn't seem to be anything twisted about it.

I agree. I do not understand the hostility...

I firmly believe that the GB Vouzelaud #GP1915 is a real sidelock.
- Nobody says in that ad that it is a 315EGL model.
- the case label says it is a sidelock.

It could be very much posterior to 1992 and not abiding by Mr Schlitz ( or whatever his name is) rule. BTW, all collectors should know that there is *NO* rule in guns.

As a matter of fact Vouzelaud is currently selling (I did not say making) sidelocks. You can look on their website the 515 PGL model.


There is no point in being worked up about it either.


Variety of systems have various pin counts and locations.
True A&D (e.g. boxlock) actions most certainly cannot be made without a bottom plate.
Other actions: trigger plate, Baker, Manufrance Ideal, Blitz, etc... can be made without one...
But I don't call them boxlocks....

Best regards,
WC-

What would be proper would be to forsake the term boxlock and revert back to A&D Body Action. Hold with the rest you mention.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Raimey, aren't there a lot of "boxlocks" that don't follow the Anson and Deeley design ? Lots of sidelocks do not follow any particular sidelock design.

I guess I'd say so with Westley Richard's pre-A&D, Greener's adaptations & I'm sure several others. Maybe the answer lies in Dig's Boxlock text. Then there's variations on the A&D Body Action like the belts & braces of the upper & lower scear & the Kerner-Anson, a staple of German platforms. Boxlock is a bit to generic noting only that the components are in a metal box.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Then there's all the American variants. I guess it would dwindle down to is the A&D Body Action platform the basis for the action.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Hypothetically erase from history the A&D Body Action & it's influence by striking out any other action in the box offering that has any similarity & I believe there would be few left; i.e. I think there to be few parallel evolutions of the action in the box less some French design.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Raimey, yes it's hard to pigeonhole the designs. There are lots of patents for "non Sidelocks" that came after the flintlock, percussion, pinfire, and more, which used the sidelock design by default. Was it 1876 for A and D ? Really just a "non Sidelock". But maybe it was the most important invention in gunmaking that we can point out. Following in no particular order in the U.S. were boxlocks from Davis, Ithaca, Baker, Parker, Colt, and several others. Some even proved in court not to be an A and D. In Britain we had , proved in court, Greener not to be an A and D infringement. Then there's the sideplated guns like Lefever, Tobin, etc that fit neither sidelock or boxlock.