doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com How to find the number one of a pair H&H Royal?

Agreed with the re-barrel, post 1954.
You can see that the SN stamps don't match the font of the SN on the action. Also note the not so great stamping job...
The question is whodunnit?
H&H will know if they have done it.
If not, the value will drop some.
However, I'd much rather have a re-barrel by the maker than a thin walled, rivelled and pitted gun...
Best regards,
WC-

B V
How can you tell it was made by a Birmingham trained barrel maker?
I'm like Wild Cattle I'll take fresh barrels over thin walls.

Jeweler;

The barrels are dovetailed lump, which is the Birmingham method of barrel construction, while chopper lump is London standard. Both methods are good methods. The chopper lump is more expensive.

You can see the two brazing lines (one on each side of the lumps) in the photo, which demonstrates that the barrels were made with a dovetailed machined into a piece of steel and that piece of steel inserted into a similar dovetailed "valley" between the two barrels, and then brazed into that valley. Afterward the piece of steel was finished machined as the lump. The lump then was finally finished by file by the gunmaker.

Bv

I see what you are saying. Neat info.So when you need to get the barrels back on face one way is to loosen the screw or unsolder and move the lump? or something like that.

Seems to me dove tail would be easier and faster to make. Tell me if I am wrong a lot easier to re build.

The bbl style is not conclusive proof.

H&H did used dovetail bbls on some of their Royals.

Boss used them on some of their guns.

Hussey used them on their Imperials.

Other London makers used them on their best-quality guns, too.


OWD

No.

Quote=jeweler:] Seems to me dove tail would be easier and faster to make. Tell me if I am wrong a lot easier to re build.

No, the dovetail method is not easier to build, but is cheaper than the chopper lump method. Chopper lump tubes require forging techniques that are not required for the simple long round dovetail lump tubes. There is much skill required to machine and fit the dovetail lump, just as there is much skill required to machine and fit the chopper section of the chopper lump barrels. For instance the choppers have to be machined at the angle required for convergence of the shot paths.

In my opinion and I believe the opinion of Purdey, Holland's, Boss and other British best quality gunmakers, a gun with dovetailed barrels is not a best quality gun, unless it has damascus barrels.

Bv

So why did H&H and Boss & Co supply dovetailed bbls on their best-quality guns?

That's not an opinion, either. That's a fact.

Many other top British gunmakers did it, too. I already pointed out H.J. Hussey.

Are you saying his Imperial Ejectors are not "best quality"? He sure thought they were.

OWD

Agreed with OWD on this. Many H&H and Boss (and others) have dovetailed lumps, especially post WWII or pre 1900.
The (only) way to know who made the barrels is to ask H&H.
Dovetailed lumps are by no mean a Brummy thing, no more than chopper lumps are a London one.
The most expensive guns usually had chopper lumps, but that's era dependent as stated above.
Best regards,
WC-