doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Different lock styles & qualities.

Not my sentiments but the Brits did once believe that 'all wogs start at Calais'. They labelled the import 'The French crutch gun' but that did not stop them from copying it!

I'll have you know I love all things non-English, as my Italian, Romanian and Iranian ex-girlfriends will testify! Ok, not 'all things', just women. Oh, and Mannlicher Schoenauer rifles!

So lads,is the "bar" anchor pin @ the bend of the mainspring actually part of the spring, or was it drilled & added separately? I just wanted to know what,if anything, that little raised filed square on the spring of the 3rd pictured lock (Woodward) was for.
cheers
franc

It helps fix the spring in place by light contact with the wall of the bar, stops it slipping or working out of the pins laterally.

ok Dig, got it...thanks alot.
franc

I am smitten by the Hill and Smith lock. Studying the pic more carefully I discenr geometry similar to a sidelock. The simplicity is refreshing, using the one spring for powering both the tumbler and the sear. It has only two axles and a pin. And on further peering there seems to be a bite and an overhang at the extremities, making me guess that perhaps it was a detachable trigger plate lock.

It obviously predates the "detachable" generation by several decades. More interesting is why such s simple concept was not copied by any of the overseas makers who turned out mediocre boxlocks and sidelocks by the barrel load. This lock would have been so much simpler to make. Perhaps it is due to the same mental inertia that caused Bland to build the gun with flat panels on the receiver and the stock, as if it were a stillborn sidelock.

Small Bore, do you ever wonder what the result might have been if a maker lavished as much attention and finishing on a simple lock like the Baker as on a Holland type lock? The examples I have come across (Midland Dreanought, Army and Navy) seem to have downgraded the internal finish.

Thank you, Dig. That is great stuff and I need to spend some time with the photos and try to figure out what goes on where. Kind regards, Gil

Dig, I see that you had to bring it up again, as I thought it was not something to "quarrel" about.
"The previous discussion regarding quality, parts, inletting etc fell back to the 'well, it doesn't shoot any better' and 'what's the point?' and completely misses the point. Mass market factory produced guns were not as well made as bespoke bench-made one-off creations. They could not be."

For one thing, I got your point, and ALL L.C. Smith side locks were hand fitted, even the lowly 00 grade (Field grade). The picture I showed of the locks of an 1885 Quality F, was again, JUST A COMPARISON, nothing else, and some turned around with some smart azz comments.

This lock would stand up to any English or European lock.


Plus I see that none of the nose in the air commenters had any comments about the L.C. Smith Quality 7, everything was hand made except the imported barrels.

Not really, it does not have an intercepting sear, and the bridle only has 2 pins (which are not greatly located, I must add).
Additionally, the spring is a tad overstressed as the limbs appear to touch in two spots. Moreover, the distance from the tumbler axis to the bent is quite small, which puts a lot of stress on it.
The fact that LC put a lot of effort on the finish, does not make it a great lock.
And after this, I'll retreat in my foxhole...
Best regards,
WC-

WC, its funny that no American gun that I know of has intercepting sears, why is that? Is it because the American maker thought we didn't need them? Probably. Back then the lock shown on this gun was the most expensive shotgun made here or abroad.
Also the lock is cocked in this picture.

Here is a quote from another forum on a thread re. the exact same subject that pretty much says it all.

"Love is blind".

FWIW I think some of the high grade LC Smith guns are very nice looking guns.