doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Shooting 3" shells in a 20 ga Bernadelli Gamecock

Exper,
Gamecock 20's are fairly light upland guns and will kick the oatmeal out of you with big loads. I shot some 1 oz Hi Vel loads out of a similar gun a couple years ago. Not pleasant and probably about the limit of the stock and other parts. I'd not beat up a little gun like yours (and your shoulder) with 3" mags even if the chambers were 3".

Hell, coyotes crumple to a .22 win mag rimfire with solid points out to over 100 yds. In effective shotgun range, say 40 yds max, a 22 mag is in it's prime. A shotgun with shot will not be effective near as far out, and a slug in a smoothbore won't cut the mustard for accuracy out at 100 yds IMO. Coyotes are thin skinned and small animals that don't take much killin, IME.

If a 22 win mag rimfire is allowed, I'd take a scoped one over a smoothbore for coyote hunting anyday.

As for turkeys, I've only hunted them once (last year) and saw a bunch but didn't get in bow range (further than shotgun range, for me). I did bring a shotgun and some #5, 1oz and a full choke. I see those guys that hunt them on TV using huge shot and extreme chokes just to hit them in the head. I've never understood the need for huge shot if they are head shooting them. But then, I've never shot one, let alone disect a turkey's head to see if it was an inch thick of bone. I recommend a 90gr Thunderhead, 3 blade, carbon shaft, 3 fletches of 4", coming off the rest at 260+ fps.

What a bunch of misinformation.

The 2 3/4", 1 1/8oz, 20ga load is one of the worst patterning shotshells one can shoot. There is usually no difference in pellets 'on target' between it and a one ounce load. There isn't enough room for a proper cushioning wad column, likewise no room for buffer.

Far from 'for idiots', the three inch 20 really shines when loaded by people who understand shotshell performance. A 1 1/8 oz load put up in a 3" case with suitable wads, powder, and buffer IS a true long range load.

Shooting a commercially offered 1 1/4oz load in a light game gun without stock thru-bolt is questionable. Wrong load, or perhaps wrong gun for the purpose as has been suggested. No fault of the 3" 20.

Experience, you seem determined to ruin that nice little twenty bore bird gun.Before you mess it up for the next owner, I'd suggest you sell it and buy a bigger gun. Bigger is always better, haven't you heard? Good manners keep me from commenting further. Chopperlump

I'm not surprised at your results. My only suggestion would be to try a few less grains of powder if possible to give more room and possibly a tighter pattern. Low and slow usually beats high and fast. Shotguns do best with lighter loads, not max ones, and more than 1 0z. in a 20 in a general sense has never made sense to me. Too much recoil, and 3" mag 20ga. loads are expensive anyway, even if loaded correctly. In the proper gun however, I can see their value, i.e., late season phez, etc.

Hold on a second. Back at the dawn of steel shot for waterfowl, it was only required in some areas, and then only in 12 gauge, in Virginia and North Carolina. It wasn't worth 2 cents. I got a 3" 20 gauge Remington 1100, and loaded up some nickel plated #3s and #5s and did some patterning, and I was quite pleased with the results, up to about 45 yards. I was never quite as enthused as Francis Sell, but it sure beat those early 12 gauge steel "blanks". I also acquired a 28" barreled little double of some Spanish manufacture that couldn't equal the Remington in patterning for waterfowl, but it turned out to be a real nice dove and quail gun. Oh, and I was able to get much better longer range performance with the 3" than with 2-3/4". I seem to remember that 1-3/16 oz was my eventual favorite load, and I think I got the receipe off an early can of Blue Dot. I still have that can somewhere. The stoutest loads I ever saw anywhere, I used them extensively. Every succeeding generation of load data stepped down the loadings.

Ditto those who say the 3" 20 has a place--I tried a whole bunch of 3" 20ga ammo in my wifes gun specifically for turkey hunting. I was able to pick up 10 yards of range over all the 2 3/4" 20's I could find, and the patterns were just fine--especially considering that for a stationary target (like a turkey) I don't think the shot stringing is an issue. Where I live only sizes 6-4 are legal for turkeys, I found that remington 3" nitro mag 1 1/4oz 6's worked best for me, giving about a 30 yard range for a one-shot kill on a turkey head-shot. The hevishot and the like from other companies DO add significant range--another 5-10 yards of effective range on a turkey in my experience, you seem to get super-extra-full patterns no matter what choke you push it through. However, I suspect that at the very least you will damage your full choke barrel by using these loads--if you want a good turkey load try a really good quality buffered lead load, or Kent Tungsten Matrix. You won't notice the recoil when there's a strutting turkey 20 yards out...pattern it with a bag of shot or a sandbag to soak up the recoil, then unless you have a much higher limit on turkeys than I do you'll only shoot twice a season.

I've never fired a 3" 20g but believe there's likely a good use for them. But it's more appropriate in a gun like a BSS or Citori, both of which typically weigh around 7lbs, or an 1100 Rem, than in a little flyweight sxs.

If Experience is just looking for killing coyotes or turkeys as a 'target of opportunity' during other hunting with the Bernie, that's one thing. But to specifically go after 'yotes with a scattergun is a tough task and requires a heck of a lot of stealth effort to get that close to 'wiley coyote'(why do you think they call them that?). We're talking bow ranges here. Take a look at this guy's techniques if you're serious.
http://www.varmintal.com/ahunt.htm

Talking about misinformation, stating that the 2 3/4" 20ga mag (1 1/8 oz) is "one of the worst-patterning shotshells" is totally at odds with what I've seen on paper. You'd expect to see more pellet strikes in a 30" circle vs a 1 oz 20ga load--but in my patterning tests, which involve actually counting pellets from the shells tested, you pick up not only more hits, but a higher PERCENTAGE of hits using the short mags. That's mainly, I think, because they're buffered.

Please understand that I'm not a huge fan of those loads, because they tend to kill on both ends, if you're shooting a light gun. But I used to kill a lot of wild pheasants with them, although I've found more reasonable solutions since then.

I believe all the "big 3" American makers (Win/Rem/Fed) offer 20ga short magnums.

I noce had an Italian made Richland 707 3" 20ga. It had a 28" mod/full bbl & I opened the right bbl to i/c. I shot primarily 2 3/4" 2½-1 loads through it but a few factory 3" 1¼ oz ones. I had one area I enjoyed squirell huntin, which did not allow rifles; period. I used here this gun with a 1 1/8oz handload off #5 shot put up in 3" cases. It proved to be a very efficient killer on the bushy tails.First goose I ever killed was with one of the factory 3" loads of #4 shot, a Blue. Gun weight was a massive 6¼lbs. With the heavier loads you knew the recoil was there, but for the times & conditions I used it I never really noticied it. The 1 1/8oz load I used was a low velocity type (around 1125 I recall), don't recall exact data now & it was quite comfortable. All in all a nice little upland gun & quite versatile. My son still has it, he also killed most of his first ducks with it.

All I want to do is to take a 'nature' walk on the WMA land right here near my house. In this state all we can use on state land are shotguns with #4 or smaller shot, bows and the .22 LR. Just recently the .17 HMR was made legal but the .22 WMR is not.

The land is just about all woods. I am just going for a walk. The best chance to get something out of season would be a crow that coasts over the tree tops but if I see a coyote I am going to shoot at it. I was just trying to get the most out of the gun for a few shots.