doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Arrieta Shotguns. Big Changes to Come

And don't forget the Germans ! my 1620 EL comes in at 6lbs 1.9oz. I like my Garbi 20 and my Hellis 12 as well-both lite but there are many choices out there as well as the Spanish/English ones

Gentlemen, I am a very big fan of Spanish guns (and German guns as well). When it came time to finally put down some real money for my very first handmade gun, it was an Arrieta 557 from New England Arms. The products coming out of Eibar these days are the absolute best value available in the world today on a handmade doublegun, bespoke or otherwise. With that said, however, I've personally handled English 2-inch 12s down to 4lbs15, and English 28s down to 5lbs1. While most 2-inch English 12s aren't quite that light (this one was Scottish), they generally run slightly under 5 1/2-lbs. The 28 bore I mentioned has 28-inch tubes and a 14 1/2 LOP, making it if anything slightly heavier than average. As much as I like Spanish "bests" it has been my experience that they generally weigh just a bit more than their vintage English counterparts, and for all the reasons that I mentioned earlier. And, as a practical matter, that is not necessarily a bad thing.

Gun Digest, February 25, ad number 9613882 Skeet grade straight grip 28" tubes, $5900. Hans has a splinter 28" 12 gauge in the winter DGJ at $4200, and a 16 DT gun at $6500. They both been there a while, IIRC.

I see lots of ads for $7000-8000, too-month after month after month. Asking is different than selling.

Best,
Ted

Agree with Lloyd on the weight thing. Comparing game guns, gun for gun, British doubles will usually be lighter than their Spanish equivalents. My Lancaster SLE, 28", goes just over 6/3 on my postal scale. Had a pair of Army & Navy boxlocks, 28", same weight. The only Spanish 12's I've owned in the same weight class were a pair of AyA #4 Deluxes, but they had the benefit of 27" barrels to shave a bit of weight. Lightest 12 I've ever owned--and you'd probably have to do some looking to find a lighter 12ga sxs unless you go to the Brit 2" guns--was a Lindner Daly Featherweight. Just barely over 5 3/4# with 26" barrels. The modern 2" Spanish 12's are nice, but a typical Brit 2"er will weigh about half a pound less.

re weight, points clarified by Lloyd3 and L Brown are appreciated and of course valid. But, and it may be more appropriate in another thread, haven't we (English style game gun owners) sort of decided as a group that those vintage way light guns (well under 6 lbs) really aren't optimal? Am I not correct that current production (post WW2) best guns weigh in mostly from 6 to 7 lbs? Peruse the offerings at H&H or Purdey and you'll find most 12s are 6 1/2 lbs and up and most 20's are right on 6 lbs. If we're comparing recent Spaniards to vintage Brits, then there is some difference. But recent to recent comps seem to indicate that weights are pretty similar. Please do not send me single examples that show differences: there are ALWAYS exceptions. I'm saying in general that there are no weight differences of note between recent Brits and recent Spaniards.

Featherweight Lindners are fantastic guns, but the Britts could build lightweights as well. I got to handle and measure a 12 bore Lincoln Jeffries last summer (w/28-inch tubes & 14 3/8 LOP) that weighed something like 5lbs10. Thomas Turner and Lincoln Jeffries competed for the "lightweight" market in England for many years and produced some remarkably light 12 bore game guns. With RST 3/4-ounce loads, these 2 1/2-inch Lightweight guns can actually throw smaller charges of shot than 2-inch 12s.

robc: In recent guns, you're absolutely right. For most gunners, it seems, if you get too far under the 6lb mark, things start to come apart. But in some unique situations, featherweight guns can offer distint advantages. With long enough tubes (usually 27-inch and up) they still swing smoothly, and on very long walks with infrequent shooting opportunities (and perhaps, older gunners?) they allow for a more rapid mount and swing on fast departing birds.

TED: Good Buddy...APPLES AND ORANGES! None close to the described gun in condition and/or features! Keep trying. Warmest Regards Jerry

I have a 28g CSMC RBL that weighs in at 5 1/2 lbs with 28 inch barrels. I can't say that it is any more difficult to shoot than my 6 lb 2 oz Garbi 28g but I haven't shot it a lot.

By necessity though, and stock lengths being equal, that reduced weight has to come out of the barrels mainly, right? How do these guns balance?

robc: Ive had something of a facination for these types of guns ever since I became a fairly serious ruffed grouse hunter (they work darn well on quail too). You basically want as much payload and pattern as you can manage to tote around all day, and yet still manage to mount and swing the gun fast enough hit something. How do they balance? Most of the ones I've been able to get my hands on balance quite nicely. I'd have to say that the majority were balanced on or near the hinge pin, or slightly forward of that. To use your word for it, they are very "lithe".

We are getting far-afield from the original intent of this posting. Perhaps another thread on this subject is warranted?