doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Three barrel gun US made in whelling Wes Va.???

I was wondering if anyone can tell me anything about This gun I have. Any info you may have would be appreciated. All I know about this one is whatI have been told be the previous owner!
The model is "three barreled gun" and I was told it was made by Malver Frank Hollinbeck in 1905 in Whelling West Va. I am told these were the only American made drillings ever made?? This one is 12 guage sxs over 30-30. He said the only thing he could ever find out was that This hollinbeck fellow set up his shop "The three barrel Gun Shop" in 1903 and died in 1910. Also was told that he was formerly a gunsmith for Syracuse Arms and principal gunsmith for Baker Gun Co. There is a serial number 8XX found on the barrels, reciever, trigger guard and forearm. Also found stamped on the reciever the patent date of feb, 13 1900. Would love to find out anything on it I could!

Whitt, There are two very ggod arcticles in the Double Gun Journal,I think from a year or two ago.I'm sure someone will let you know soon.
Dave

Hollenbeck/Three-Barrel/Royal Gun Companies

Hollenbeck Gun Co. 1901-early 1905
Three-Barrel Gun Co. Late 1905-early 1908
Royal Gun Co. 1909-May 1910

The shot barrels were offered in 12-, 16-, 20-, and 28-gauge (only Hollenbeck Gun Co.), with the rifle barrel at various times in .22 WCF, 25-20 Win., 25-20 SS, 25-25 Stevens, 30 WCF, 32-20 Win., 32 Ideal, and 32-40. It appears to me that 25-25 Stevens and 32-40 were by far the most common calibers.

One often sees guns marked Three-Barrel Gun Company on the barrels with a Hollenbeck Butt Plate, or marked Royal Gun Company on the barrels with a Three-Barrel Gun Company Butt Plate. One also sees quite a few of these guns unmarked in any way except for the serial number and the patent date, which were probably taken by workers in-lieu-of pay. "Patd FEB 13, 1900" which was Frank A. Hollenbecks patent number 643,601 which covered the bolting, and was also used on the Baltimore Arms Company double guns. Frank A. Hollenbeck's Patent # 753,492 granted Mar. 1, 1904 covered the locks and cocking mechanism, though I've never seen this date stamped on one of the guns. All three companies also offered
doubles, and the latter two offered a single barrel trap gun of Lefever design.

My two-part article on these companies was in The Double Gun Journal, Volume Thirteen, Issues 2 and 3. There was an article on a very interesting one of these guns fitted with a Miller single trigger in the Arms Gazette for September 1978, and one in The American Rifleman for June 1964.

These were not the only American drillings. William H. Baker and his partner Lyman C. Smith made three-barrel guns in Lisle and later Syracuse, New York in the late 1870s/early 1880s. Frank Hollenbeck worked for them part of that time.

I have actually seen a three bbl LC Smith ( marked on bbl) with broken stock. An old lady brought to a gunshop I nearly lived in about 40 years ago. Seems it had belonged to her departed husband. She couldn/t or wouldn't pat for a restocking and wouldn't sell it. The gun gathered dust for onver a year while she tried to decide what to do with it. One day I walked into the back room / work area with a hand full of cash looking for the piece. I was going to get her name and number & offer her a tidy sum but it and the claim check/work order were gone. Never could find that woman. Aaaah well. Ken

Thanks for the info!

There is one in a gunshop about 8 miles from me. Thats the first one i have ever seen. About 3-4 months ago there was one in the paper,called the guy he did not know what it was worth; he was taking offers. He was from Huston Pa.

Kirkwood of Boston and Dan Lefever also made 3 barrel guns.
Granite

Whitt,
Could you provide some additional information please. Steel or Damascus shotgun barrels, length? Configuration of the stock, engranving pattern, etc. We should also be able to tell you what grade your drilling is as well. I have some of the original catalogs and other material. What is the serial number? Thanks

Mine has steel barrels. they are 28" long though I am not sure what they are choked. You can actually see pics on gunbroker.com as I have it listed there now!

Granite, David Kirkwood made a great deal about his "drillings", featuring them as the first items in his catalog. They were also quite expensive, and entirely handmade. He made them in hammer as well as hammerless. They were also offered with rifle choked "paradox" bores. It seems that not enough attention is paid to this innovative American gunmaker.
All the best, Mal

It could be that Mr. Kirkwood just didn't have enough output to generate the interest that the other makers of his time did. The Kirkwood "drilling" is a very scarce item, just like the Lefever "drilling".

David Kirkwood is an American gunmaker I have not heard mentioned on here before. Can you direct us to some references about his guns?

I would start with 'The Kirkwoods of Boston" by CDR Roy Gunther, "The Gun Report" January, 1992.

I have a really poor copy of "The Unusual Kirkwood Story" from "The
Sporting Goods Dealer" February, 1951. I've been looking for a good copy of this for years with little luck.

My friend has a 3-bbl 12 ga shotgun. Were any of these made in the USA?

It is high time that a comprehensive history of the Kirkwood guns and rifles was published in a contemporary venue. Somehow, although I have high asperations, I never can find the time to do such things! If anyone wants to take up the challenge, my small accumulation of Kirkwoods, two "drillings" one unfinished, and a double unfinished "paradox", as well as two different catalogs and some 20's vintage advertising, are available for study. I have a long time friend with a few "rare" Kirkwoods; whom I am sure would also cooperate in such a venture. Michael, I'm sure you know to whom I'm referring. The gauntlet has been tossed!
All the best, Mal

That is one article that I would love to read. Long over due, and I for one hope that it gets done right.

Mal, I could not agree more but my dance card is full and I see no letup in sight. Ten years ago I figured I’d knock out the custom rifle makers then turn my attention to the custom shotgun makers. I have a filing cabinet drawer full of custom shotgun maker info but little will see publication. There are several members of this BBS and ones I KNOW read this that could very well do the job. As you know my last great Kirkwood double went to your friend. I sent my Kirkwood file to one man in New York who copied it so I know there are folks with the info. Shooting & Fishing has a lot of Kirkwood info including articles by Margaret Kirkwood. I will share whatever I know with anyone who wants to tackle this job.

Here are a couple pics of my Kirkwood Bros 10ga apart. It has steel barrels and the only proof marks are the ones shown on the barrels ahead of the flats. This gun is not like a lot of the cheaper "put your name on it" (ie Clarbrough sp?)guns from England that I have seen before. It is of higher quality and really a nice gun. Does anybody recognize the design as that of an English maker? I like to think the barrels were brought into the US and the rest of the gun made by Kirkwood, but I dont know. Ross

Have several Kirkwood guns at Terry Allen's for photos for
Double Gun Journal articles. Hopefully when photos are done
articles will be done-This is a very slow process.One or two
articles on M/L conversions and hammer guns. Another on Drillings
Mal, I would love to have any info you have. I have the Gunther article and the 1924 Kirkwood catalogue only.
Have 8 Kirkwoods conversion hammers and drillings
Reguards
Bill McPhail

Those very simple locks seem almost identical to the LC Smith's, with two minor modifications: The main spring's location is rotated 180 degrees, fore on the Kirkwood and back on the Smith; the third bridle mounting screw is low on the Kirkwood (in a location vacated by the spring's relocation), while it is near the top of the Smith's lock.

Have a handfull of Kirdwoods. Most hammer guns, one with Linder markings.
Granite

I don't believe that I have ever seen a Lindner marked Kirkwood, would you care to expand on the subject, I'm sure many would be interested.

what does one of these usually sell for when available?

Hard question to answer they made every sort of gun you can imagine, what kind are you asking about? Kirkwood guns range from imported shotguns with the Kirkwood name on them to a 4.5 lb 20-gauge hand made double. Any Kirkwood or for that matter any custom made gun has to be evaluated independent of others.

The proof mark appears to be the preliminary proof mark given to the tubes prior to assembly into a bbl set. This would go along with your thoughts as the finished gun would not have been in England for final proofing.
Incidentally, I have a J P Clabrough, & while certainly not a Purdey, Boss etc I would not call it a ""cheaper "put your name on it" (ie Clarbrough sp?)guns from England"". It is a quite well made gun indeed & from an 1895/96 Clabrough, Glocher & Co catalog varied in price from the basic non-ejector field grade @ $50.00 up to their best ejector @ $250.00. This cheapest grade is priced, from the same catalog $2.00 under a PH Parker & $5.00 above a quality 1 L C Smith. The cheaper "put your name on it" guns are about half or less of this price.

I was wondering what the hollenbeck or the three barrel gun sells for when found!

Gentlemen,

I need a recommendation for someone to install a leather covered pad.

Regards,

Max

Whitt, the going price all depends on gauge, grade, gauge, condition, gauge, originality, gauge, barrel material (Crescent, Krupp or Damascus), and gauge.

Whitt:

"The Hollenbeck"-marked Syracuse Arms gun in 12 gauge, damascus, 12 gauge, original buttplate, 12 gauge, clean bores, no dents, good external finish barrels, more than rumours of case, 12 gauge: 8-1100$. Very thick barrels! Know nutting about dreilings from 3-Barrel Gun. Not sure if this is part of what you were asking but answer for you on the 2-barrel side if you are?

jack

When I get a few spare minutes. I'll take some pics.
Granite

When I get a few spare minutes. I'll take some pics.
Granite

2Pieper,
I didnt mean to infer that Clabrough guns are poorly made. I have seen several that were marked with US companies names that fall between a P and G grade Parker as far as decoration, they all seem to have a fluffy running spaniel of some kind engraved on the sidepate and the triggerplate has a clover shap in front of the triggerguard. Not low quality guns at all. I cant remember his name but a guy involved with the California SXS association (maybe founder) has some exquisite Clabrough guns that are very high quality guns.

This gun I have is decorated about the same as the Clabrough guns for the US trade,(I know Clabrough ended up in California) but is a higher quality gun.

Another "Kirkwood".

Now, THAT'S the Kirkwood I was interested in seeing!!! Nice, nice, nice rifle!!

Was Kirkwood a gunsmith or a manufacture? Maybe I missed something in the thread. It looks all the world like a Springfield O3-A3 to me. Very nicely done as well!

The Kirkwood family were gunmakers, they did every thing from hand made double barrel shotguns to fixing up old military rifles like the one above. When the business was bought by Bob Jones (?) they had been in business for 99 years, a lot of different stuff can be found with their name on it.

I know this is a rather old topic however, I just received a drilling made by the Three Barrel Gun Company in Wheeling WV. Very interesting.

12x12x.32-40 and the rear sight rotates up on a sort of ratchet to allow for range adjustment. Can't wait to get my right hand out of the cast and shoot it.

Well done, and remember that this is an OLD gun and make nice with the 32-40 ammo, lead bullets and gentle loads.
Mike

You might want to contact member Marks_21 for information on guns made by Three Barreled Gun Company. He seemed to have a lot of knowledge and experience with them.

I still kick myself for passing up on the purchase of one of these American Drillings in 12x12x.30-30 at a pretty fair price a number of years ago. I only had enough money with me to buy either it, or a 12 ga. VH Parker, and chose the Parker. You can find a nice VH Parker any day, but not so much with the Three Barreled Gun Company Drilling.

Cherry's in Greensboro, NC had a bunch of Hollebeck guns. They still have a couple of drillings.
http://www.cherrys.com/longguns.htm

While probably not surprising and likely true of most 100 year old mechanical items, I have found they really benefit from a good cleaning and careful reassembly. I think they are the coolest thing going and a really cool way to hunt.
I have dies and loads for my guns in 25-35, 30-30 and 32-40. I have done the least with the 32-40. I am considering working up .32 loads with the leverevolution flex tips soon.

Michael Petrov's post named "Bob Jones" as the successor. I think the proper name is Bob Smith. A very rare error in MP's postings.

Definitely a hand load proposition. I got 5 boxes of John Wayne Commemorative ammo in the deal. It's .32-40 but for what it's bringing for collectors I'll sell it and buy brass.

There seem to be a lot of the Hollebeck guns around. The Three Gun ones Cherry's have are all Damascus barrels that I could see and the condition on those wasn't as nice as the one I picked up. The one they have for $1750 has a little more engraving on the receiver, the bear and deer, but condition wise it is no better than the one I bought and I paid less with the ammunition.

I'll get up with Marks_21. Thanks for the tip. I'd like to know more about the company.

I see my post back on the first page of this thread is from before I got Rudy Kostelecky's copy of the Three-Barrel and Royal Gun Co. ledger for the three-barrel guns. Rudy's Gun Shop in Cantonment, Florida, had a lot of the remains of the Hollenbeck/Three-Barrel/Royal Gun Co.'s back in the day. From the ledger we can add .25-35 WCF and .25-36 Marlin to the rifle calibers.

Give me the serial number on your new toy and I can check what the ledger has.