doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com No love for Winchester Model 21?

Where is "Der Klunkermeister" (R.I.P.) when we need him?

Best,
Ted

I would find another gun for pigs.



I am not up to date on all these fellows but give them a call.

Try Bob Day at R&D Custom Barrels in Pico Rivera, 562-923-3608.
Jack Dockweiler is still working ? his shop is at the Redlands Trap & Skeet Club.
Pete Stepanski at Bain & Davis in San Gabriel on Valley Blvd.
Mike's Gun Smithing in Long Beach, (562) 984-2529
Bolsa Gunsmithing in Westminster

Les Pittman of Phelan CA. (760)868-2424
Address is; 7688 Joshua Street, Phelan, California 92371
Les is a former Pachmeyer gunsmith

Where did he say anything about using slugs? When I hunt hogs with a shotgun it is because I just may have to wade in amongst them. Buckshot is the proper load here. Full choke may (or may not) be a bit tight for best patterning with them, only testing can tell that, but I can guarantee there won't be any holes in the pattern a hog can get through. I don't know how they are hunted in Callyforny, but trying to use a rifle or slugs on hogs in some situations here will get you acquainted with the local emergency room tailor, quick.

It also is not a given that steel will ruin a set of full choked barrels. Granted, it is not wise to use steel in something that tight. Patterns usually suffer, and there is a greater risk of shot bridging causing damage to the choke area, but it is not guaranteed like some would have you believe.

SRH

It is also not a give that shooting a slug through a full choke bbl is going to damage it. Several slug designs took into consideration they were apt to be fired from full choke guns & were designed to be capable of passing through them without damage to the gun. Better accuracy is generally obtained through a more open choked bbl however. Also many doubles will not put a slug from the two bbls to the same point of impact, one simply has to try & see. The old Ithaca Derslayer bbls were reputed to be quite accurate with slugs (I never owned one) & they were bored undersize to a cyl bore of about the dia of a normal full choke for their entire length.

Ted: I once saw a man win over $100,000.00 shooting flyers in NC with a Model 21 Winchester. I doubt if he thought he was shooting a klunker and I certainly don't consider the one's I own as 'klunkers'! Model 21s are really great for certain apps. I guess to each his own, though.

Buzz,
I was referring to a former poster, Russ Ruppel. Russ passed away a few years back. He had his own opinion of the model 21. It was a little different than your opinion.

Best,
Ted

Thanks Ted. I wasn't trying to start a fight over the pros and cons of the 21. I think they are extremely well made guns with chopper lump barrels and very strong Winchester Proof Steel. They are a little heavy ESP in the 12 gauge. The 20's and 16's are lighter, but some of them even approach or exceed 7 lbs. 21's with ventilated ribs seem heavier than their matted rib counterparts, at least the one's I have handled. They are the only S xS that looks right with a vent rib and beaver tail forearm imo, which may be indicative of their intended and more appropriate applications??

Teds just wanting someone to ask what he thinks of a Moss'burg.

I love these guns.
Detractors will say what they will but these doubles have SOUL. Made in America, by Americans, for Americans.

Roll that beautiful bean footage...

]
-Top is a 6lb 2oz 20 bore, DT SFE ca. 1934
-below is a 6lb 10 oz Tournament 2 bbl 20 bore, 30" Full/Mod, 28" IC/WS2 ca.1934
-below is a 6lb 12 oz 20 bore "Skeet" ca. 1948
-bottom is a Custom Shop "Flatside" 12 gauge ca.1938

Those are some beautiful guns you have there, Bob! I am especially fond of your straight grip 20 bore. I have always wanted one of those. Seems like a perfect bird gun at 6 lb 2 oz.