doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Is this a Mod 21 Hession forearm, or what?

Dick, tell us more about the "late" Custom Built 32" gun. That is a scarce variation. What is the serial number, and the exact configuration?

Serial # is in the 33K range. Gun is marked 'Custom Built by Winchester' on rib, 32" VR IM/F Flatside with no engraving. As you see, has Monte Carlo with Shadow Line Cheeckpiece. 12 gauge 2&3/4" markings on barrel of course. Single line border on checkering and barrel markings makes this just before the 'Custom Shop' era but otherwise fully consistant with 'Custom Built', engine turned surfaces and forearm insert.
Actually purchased the gun because the wood was so spectacular.
I believe that this gun was made shortly before the 'Custom Shop' era and possibly ordered before the Custom Shop but delivered during the era. How would Winchester have handled order submitted before and delivered during? who knows. probably lost in the mists of antiquity. Anyway, showed the gun to Tony Galazan and he agrees that its Winchester original and offered to purchase on the spot from me. Really spectacular piece of work. Won't tell you the dealer that sold it to me but dealers treat guns as commodities and the forearm just wasn't noticed or thought much about. I surmise the other problem for purchasers was that the gun had no record which is different than a gun that has a record and been changed. I took a good look at it, called one dealer that had seen the gun and purchased it.
It took Schwing's book and putting these forearms together to sort out the 'Hession' for me. At least i think so, you never know.-Dick

BTW I believe 'Field Beavertail' is another name for 'Hession' style.
The 'Duck' forearm was used for comparison because it has the Trap dimensions.
Does this answer the question of what constitutes a 'Hession' style Forearm? -Dick

Dick, thanks for your pics. The forearm on your 32" gun looks definitely narrower than the Duck/Trap grade one. It looks like it's the same as the narrow width one I recently bought, but is shorter than mine. From all the replies here I have concluded that the reference in Schwing's book to the Hession forearm being the same length (9.67") as the Skeet and the Field beavertail forearms is suspect. The Hession forearm is definitely narrower and has less mass... but apparently they were made in shorter and longer lengths depending on the specifications in the order. In any case the one I bought recently is now on my Trap 21 and it handles and looks much better (to my eye) than the original bulkier one. Not to worry, I'm keeping the original prewar version BT forearm so the next owner has the option of using either one. Silvers

The assertion that all 'Skeet' forends are 9.67" is more than suspect, it's flat out incorrect. I own one that's 10.75", the gun letters as original, and I've seen it's twin.

Schwing's book is excellent, but it has limitations.

You seem to be correct about the Ducks. Even a prewar 3" gun leaning up behind the barn, not marked Duck or Magnum, has an 11" forearm. However, there are a bunch of short barrel skeet guns that also have the 11" forearm. Yes, they came from the factory that way and they look like heck. I just measured a 1935 12 gauge Tournament with one of those things hanging off the front and now I know why that gun has always looked like it had 24" barrels when they were actually 26". Schwing gives dimensions for the Hession forearm but the difference between this and the field forearm is very slight, so it may be hard to recognize without careful measuring with calipers. There is more difference in forearms of the same style in different eras and days of the week than there is in different styles. If you want your slim field gun to have a Hession forearm, all you have to do is say it.

I looks to me like you actually have a Skeet forend takeoff, replaced because the owner shared Eightbore's opinion of it's appearance.

The rare 11" Hession forend conclusion seems like a stretch.

But, as Bill said, call it what you want...

I had a "Duck' at one time that came with 2 forends, sorta like this if I remember correctly :



http://bluepike.tripod.com/Model21/duckgun/hession.htm

Well, maybe it's a long "trimmer-type" forearm that came from a skeet gun but it's within 1/8" of the length of my original Trap gun's forearm.

If anyone has a HESSION FOREARM THAT LETTERS AS SUCH, would you please post a few pics, and also the X,Y and Z plane dimensions as measured with a caliper? Unless I missed something in one of the posts, no one seems to have done that. Without a letter stating it's a real Hession forearm everything else is speculation.

Personally I'm a bit disappointed that Schwing seems to have taken a "swing" at the Hession description without doing more research and/or including a picture in the book. Silvers

Silvers, I agree with you that Schwing's measurements of the Hession forearm are just a "swing". I have seen Model 21 forearms that are as slim as they should all have been, but they were special orders that never made it to standard models because they were way too fragile to be put in regular production. What really belongs on standard 20 gauge Model 21s is a forearm that looks and feels like the Parker Repro 28 gauge forearm. However, it would be unacceptable for production because of possible breakage. A 12 gauge forearm in proportion could have, but was not, put in production for the same reasons.