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Joined: Dec 2011
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Does anyone have any pictures of the inside/internals/backside of a stepped lock? I'm very curious about how they differ mechanically from the common back action lock.
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,913 Likes: 201
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,913 Likes: 201 |
Not yet. I did have plans to inspect the double in the 1st post but someone wanted it far more that I did. But that image is what pretty much began this whole tangent.
Kind Regards,
Raimey rse
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,913 Likes: 201
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,913 Likes: 201 |
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Joined: Dec 2011
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 70 |
Not yet. I did have plans to inspect the double in the 1st post but someone wanted it far more that I did. But that image is what pretty much began this whole tangent.
Kind Regards,
Raimey rse Hopefully someone does and will stick them up.
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,913 Likes: 201
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,913 Likes: 201 |
Baumgarten is supposed to pleasure us with some images of a Jaeger rifle from Suhl. We surmise that the novel lock may have added structural integrity to the sporting weapon.
Frantisek/Franz Novak/Nowak kaiserlich - königlich( Császári Es Királyi Udvari Puskamüves ) Höfbüchsenmacher of Praze must have hung out his gunmaking shingle in the mid to late 1820s as from 1829 to 1836 he attended Bohemian Exhbitions and received silver and bronze medals, with a bronze medal being at the Vienna Exhibition in 1835. Then in 1844 in Berlin he received a bronze medal for his effort on his wares. He designed and developed some sort of safety, or mechanism with safety features, that led to at least one of his awards. The firm employed around 30 craftsmen, which increased to say 3 dozen by the mid 19th century, and sourced tubes from Bohemia as well as Liege in order to provide upper rung sporting weapons to clients in the Empire, Poland, Russia, France and England. He was known for either sourcing or fabricating some sort of tubes, Bürschrohr und Scheibenrohr - 2 terms that have escaped me for now. Either he or a Gabriel Novak, who I guess to be his son, was a source of target pistols with special designed triggers.
It is possible that Ferdinand Ridler/Riedler of Spital on the Pyhrn(Spital am Pyhrn, Austria) could have been the Bohemian tube steel source for Frantisek Novak & other Praha craftsmen. Ferdinand Ridler is noted as being the 1st to roll his own as well as introducing pattern welded tubes to the empire. In 1845 a presentation of his home grown and rolled pattern welded tubes, which were asthetically easy on the eyes as well as durable being on par with any other craftsmen, led to an award. He was also know for his edged weapons.
Jozsef Kirner may have sourced Ferdinand Ridler as they used both local, within the empire I would say, in addition to sourcing the craftsmen in Liege for their multibarrel sporting weapons. Jozsef Kirner is noted as offering a vierling, which he easily could have sourced from A.V. Lebeda. The concern employed 20 craftsmen to complete sporting weapons for clients in England, Russia, Poland, France & Turkey. In the 1830s A.V. Lebeda could not find a source near Praze to meet his demand for tubes so straightaway he developed a soucing line to Liege.
Kind Regards,
Raimey rse
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,913 Likes: 201
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,913 Likes: 201 |
Many thanks to furhmann for the images and all the effort on the translation of the Anton Vinzenz Lebeda info docs. Yes, another grainy image but it will have to suffice for now. "The muzzleloader with percussion lock constitutes the main body of his work, and his successful 1828 invention of the so-called Prague boxlock was often copied in the continent and in England. At the Bohemian Country Trade Fair in Prague (1829) Lebeda received a silver medal, and on 22.12.1830 he received a further privilege for a “hunting gun with a safety catch”." "Cap lock for percussion guns, patent 1828; Hunting gun with a safety catch, patent 1835." - Ref. for translated 1965 Austrian document. Translated from the doc and I wonder if this is December 22nd 1830 safety catch? Also what might be the "Prague boxlock"? Kind Regards, Raimey rse
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 234
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 234 |
Raimey and I were just talking about stepped locks and such last night and I had reminded him that my Christoph Funk (Suhl) had stepped locks very much like the Lebeda pistols. As to the thought that the longer than typical lock plates seen on the Jozsef Kirner Pesten (1st gun) were to add reinforcement to the grip, seeing it again this morning they don't appear that much longer than standard issue back action locks so who knows? Again, I like the ornate profile. I'll add that I sure am enjoying the fine examples being shown on this thread. Regards, Buchseman Here are some pictures of the Christoph Funk jaeger rifle that Raimeys mentions: Regards, Buchseman
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 129 Likes: 5
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 129 Likes: 5 |
My feeling is that these stepped lockplates are a fashion thing, of a certain period. And up to now I have only seen percussion this way. The Prague boxlock may be this: Regards, fuhrmann
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,913 Likes: 201
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,913 Likes: 201 |
Thanks fuhrmann. Can you tell what the letters are under the crown atop the tubes: "AL", "LB", etc.? Also thanks for pointing out that Bürschrohr und Scheibenrohr - stalking rifle and target rifle. Were the tubes that much different? Baumgarten, thanks for the effort and are the initials MB on the component for M. Baumgarten? Kind Regards, Raimey rse
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