doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Lack of proof marks frustrating.

I'm thinking about buying this gun but the person who has it presently has very little knowledge about firearms. He says that he thinks it's a 28 bore. I would like to have some confirmation of that before sending the check. I can't see any proof marks that would confirm anything except that it has a final "view" mark and "Patent No 30?? and a use # 1641" Anyone see anything else that I'm missing?

Not much help Mike, but that might be Faux (roll graved rather than acid etched) Damascus.

It's a Lang so I'd doubt that. I just can't believe there's no more proof marks on a Lang than that.

I'm the fathest away from being an expert, but I wondered about that Damascus even before I read Drew's post, and he IS an expert. The patterns just don't look like they're PART of the steel so much as they're ON TOP of the steel. I realize that's not the most coherent way of saying what I want to.

If you look at the barrels, the patterns look like they're RAISED off the steel, exactly like they're rolled on, as Drew mentions. I'd bet if you passed your finger slowly over the barrels you'd feel every bump the marks made.

I know if it were me I'd want the seller to provide more photos to substantiate the gun being a Lang, as in Joseph Lang not Harvey Lang, if you get my drift.

I also agree with you about the lack of marks, proof and other. I just can't imagine a gun of that ilk not having them. As you say, frustrating.

Once upon a time it was the fashion to etch Damascus barrels. More in Europe than England and more for muzzleloaders than breechloaders. But I've seen some breechloaders that were etched. Both locks are marked Joseph Lang & Sons verified with photos.

See. I told you I wasn't an expert!

I hope this gun works out for you.

Mike,

The Germans were big on heavily etched damascus for a time. It seems to me that it resembles some of the Ottoman miqulet guns I have seen as well as the heavily etched German guns. The Ottoman guns were etched in nitric acid. Scroll down here to the 8th image:
http://www.damascus-barrels.com/Image_barrels.html

Later, damascus barrels as we know them were lightly etched with sulphuric acid, at least in Belgium.

It appears that one barrel has the mark JC which is the trade mark of Joseph Cap. Cap was a well known barrel maker who was active from about 1904-1920. His father and his sons were also in the trade.

Pete

Pete I noticed the initials also but had no idea of who they belonged to. The dates seem wrong to me. I believe the gun would be much older due to: etched damascus barrels, no proof marks, and non rebounding hammergun. But this gun is a borderline buy/no buy for me without some more info. It has some very desirable qualities but has some problems that send warning signals to me. That's why I solicited our experts advice here.

Pete,Deep etching of damascus is some times seen on early guns by John Rigby.

Mike, it doesn't look like the quality that I would expect to see in a genuine gun by Lang of London. Is there any address on the top rib? Lagopus.....