doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com CASE COLORS

take a look at gunbroker item 246824149. colors look like a bi product of factory high heat bone charcoal case hardening to me. your opinion?

My opinion is that you are a idiot and these post are getting tiring. Are you trying to make your torch jobs legit by pointing out others do the same or worse thing to guns? Like a person who robs a gas station claiming that he is not as bad as the person who robbed a bank. Stop trying to defend what you are doing to these guns. Sell your guns as you like, but I know that that is not rain I feel in my ear. You are like a fat person who points at other fat people and claims he is average. A torch job is just that, not a fine restoration of a gun but a cheap hack job to trick the eye of those who do not know. Most if not all here do know. If you wish to be counted in the minority keep posting.

wow! i think this one looks kinda nice. sorry, you don't like it...guess this means you have no opinion as to the origin of the case colors on this gun? i do agree with you on one thing. some of these posts are getting tiring...yours is a good example.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=246343764


Take a look at this torched up POS! And you claim these to be near original colors?

battle: just so you know, the case colors on this gun were restored via a controlled, low heat, chemical process. the receiver was not heated beyond critical temperature. the original factory heat treating and case hardening were not disturbed. the bright colors are in fact similar to what parker was doing in the late 19th century when this gun was originally manufactured. i test fired this gun on the skeet range using rst light loads. it is a fun shooter with either set of barrels. the other shooters there commented on how attractive this gun looked overall.

guess you too have no opinion regarding the case colors of the gun referenced in the beginning of this thread.

i know it's hard, but it would be nice some of you out there could stay on topic and not digress to useless personal attacks...it just wastes time.

What's 'low heat'. I think 'the original factory heat treating and case hardening' are one in the same. If someone applied heat, are you sure nothing was disturbed.

Nothing personal, but my rookie taste agrees that the colors on battle's link didn't quite come out right. If it works for you though, no gripe here.

Thanks 2-piper if you're out there for taking the time on the other thread.

Craig;
Yes out here. As I posted on the other thread tempering of a heat-treated part begins taking place around 350�F. The hotter it goes above that the more it is tempered (Softened). Virtually the last smidgen of hardness put in by the heat/quench process can be tempered out without ever re-crossing the critical temp.
Colors which are artificially produced at temps below 200�F are not temper colors & have no affect on the heat-treatmant. Temper colors, such as those produced by the concentrated flame of an accetylene torch "DO" affect the heat-treat as do those put on uniformally by a high heat process as charcoal bluing. Guns so finished were not normally Case Hardened & were designed around the constraints of a soft steel body.
It is noted that the late Selma AL gunsmith Ralph Walker advocated this torch method of coloring. He had several other practises with which I strongly disagreed as well.

ED; I have fully refrained from making any personal attack on this subject BUT;

"...the case colors on this gun were restored via a controlled, low heat, chemical process. the receiver was not heated beyond critical temperature."

"IF" your definition of "Low Heat" is any temp below the critical temp then you purely know not whereof you speak. The original hardness as I pointed out above can be totally destroyed without ever reaching that critical temp. This is all verifiable.

2-piper: i cannot define low heat specifically. in general, i can define low heat as not hot enough to change the original factory heat treating and case hardening of the receiver; and of course, to do no harm to the safety and durability of the receiver.

regarding the parker pictures and venomous comments posted by battle, the goal of this case coloring effort was to attempt reproduce, as close as possible, the parker gh case colors as produced by the parker factory in the late 19th century. whether or not the effort was successful is difficult to determine, as there are so few parkers of that vintage that have enough bright case colors left to make an intelligent comparison. one did pass through my hands years ago, that one had about 50% original case color left, mostly on the top tang, lever and in hidden areas. doing a comparison from memory, this one is pretty close; bright with golds, blues. however, i do not recall any reds.

do you have an opinion as to the origin of the case colors on the shotgun referenced in the beginning of this thread?

Battle,
I believe that gunbroker link to gun that gun Ed is selling is the best example that we could have of a novice taking a torch to an action and ruining it forever. Maybe someone could direct him to a metalurgy class. I have had one and have done color case hardening and I am horrified at these torching jobs, as everyone else is..

stallones: please note the work done was not case hardening. case hardening was already done at the parker factory. it is not necessary to undo what the factory did, in order to restore case colors.

also, if you failed read my reply to 2-piper above. please do so, as you apparently are unaware of what was accomplished here.

and, do you have an opinion as to the origins of the case colors for the gun referenced in the beginning of this thread?