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Forums10
Topics39,496
Posts562,070
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Most Online9,918
Jul 28th, 2025
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 13,883 Likes: 19
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 13,883 Likes: 19 |
Find yourself a "clunker" in a 20g if you upland hunt. It will give you a small insight into what the guys are talking about when they discuss 'quick handling', and these 'magic wands' that seem to garner some an almost worship like attention. A Nitro Special, Fulton, etc, in 20g is a start in that direction. Even a little NID 20g extractor gun can be found for reasonable money if you aren't picky about finish condition.
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 14,013 Likes: 1817
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 14,013 Likes: 1817 |
It appears to me that the point is being missed. The original poster says he wants a "clunker" (later amended to a "beater" so as not to offend). He already has an NID (a nice gun), so why point him toward a Fox, Smith or Parker, which would be on par with the gun he already has (or possibly better as they go up in grade)?
That Hunter Arms, a Western Arms, or a Nitro Special would seem to be the obvious choices in a "step-down" American double. Or my personal favorite, a nice old Stevens 5100. Because he ASKED specifically about Foxes, and their virtues. That's why. There ARE beat-up Sterlingworths around, ya' know. SRH
May God bless America and those who defend her.
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 49
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 49 |
Thanks for the advice. I'm starting to get a better idea of what I'm looking for. What I'm discovering is that a well used classic doesn't cost much more (or maybe even less) than something like a 311. Which is something that I didn't realize. I'm mostly a lurker here and I'm always impressed with the amount of knowledge and passion that some here have for these guns. And I've come to realize that the word "clunker" means different things to different people and I hereby strike it from my vocabulary! (I have a feeling that I'm going to end up with something nicer than what I say I'm looking for).
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 7,065 Likes: 1
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 7,065 Likes: 1 |
This gun has possibilities. Kirby lists the wall thickness - always one of my worries. These are more than adequate. The screws aren't buggered. I prefer Parkers without ejectors. Gun is heavy enough to shoot clays comfortably. I could carry it on a pheasant hunt now and then. Overchoked, you could reload spreaders or have the choke(s) opened. LOTS of drop though. I shoot one with that much drop all the time. 3" drop at the heel is not very popular these days. Parker VH at Vintage Doubles This is the description. Parker Brothers V grade 12
Serial# 130004
12 gauge Boxlocks
Price: $900
Action: Boxlock
Ejector: No
Barrel Type: Steel
Barrel Length: 30
Proof:
Nitro: 2 3/4
Black:
Choke:
Left: .036 extra full
Right: .036 extra full
Minimum Wall Thickness:
Left: .035
Right: .035
LOP: 13 wood now 14
Drop:
Comb: 1 13/16
Heel: 3
Cast Off: 0 cast
Cast On:
Weight: 7 lbs. 15.5 oz.
FFL Required: Yes
Description:
Solid gun with little blue and some handling marks. The gun is tight and ready for shooting.Best, Mike
Last edited by AmarilloMike; 05/15/11 04:36 PM.
I am glad to be here.
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,164 Likes: 3
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,164 Likes: 3 |
It appears to me that the point is being missed. The original poster says he wants a "clunker" (later amended to a "beater" so as not to offend). He already has an NID (a nice gun), so why point him toward a Fox, Smith or Parker, which would be on par with the gun he already has (or possibly better as they go up in grade)?
That Hunter Arms, a Western Arms, or a Nitro Special would seem to be the obvious choices in a "step-down" American double. Or my personal favorite, a nice old Stevens 5100. Because he ASKED specifically about Foxes, and their virtues. That's why. There ARE beat-up Sterlingworths around, ya' know. SRH Easy there, pard; no offense intended. He asked about "clunkers" and folks start telling him to look for Foxes, Parkers, Smiths, yada yada. After someone suggested a Fox, he asked about them. Those guns are not my idea of clunkers, and if one of those were to qualify, I'm not sure I'd want to own it. But I guess like Chuck says, one man's clunker is another man's Purdey. I happen to be a Fox guy myself; I'm lucky enough to own a few. Now, if I misread his original post and his query, sorry. But to Sidekick I'll say this: folks'll tell you that you can find a fine gun for the price of a 311, but in my experience such finds are few and far between; far enough that I've never found one at least. Any upper level gun you find at a 311 price is likely to be in a basket - either that or those guys are paying way too much for their 311's. I don't know how old you are, but at my age, I don't have time to wait for the deal of the century, and I don't have the money or the patience to waste on guns I can't shoot. But that's just me; you asked a question and I gave an opinion, just like everybody else here. Good luck with your search!
Last edited by Fin2Feather; 05/15/11 07:41 PM.
The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits. - Albert Einstein
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,292
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,292 |
Sidekick:
The "clunky" Foxes-Sterlingworths are the ones built by "Savage" after 1931....suggest you check the serial numbers of what you are looking at until you know the difference....which is obvious, starting with the Savage name on the left barrel for the post '31 guns.......
In the LC Smith line the "clunky" ones are the Marlin built guns that were built after 1945 when Hunter Arms went broke (October '45).......also do a serial number check and you will know what you are looking at......after 1945 prefix "S" in the serial........
Both of these companies offered 'cheaper' quality guns after the change of ownership and employees......but often, sellers will ask prices equal to that of the "real deal" LC's and Foxes...just on name recognition alone, hoping they can 'snag' a buyer.....
Good Luck with your search.......
Doug
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,164 Likes: 3
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,164 Likes: 3 |
Sidekick:
The "clunky" Foxes-Sterlingworths are the ones built by "Savage" after 1931....suggest you check the serial numbers of what you are looking at until you know the difference....which is obvious, starting with the Savage name on the left barrel for the post '31 guns.......
In the LC Smith line the "clunky" ones are the Marlin built guns that were built after 1945 when Hunter Arms went broke (October '45).......also do a serial number check and you will know what you are looking at......after 1945 prefix "S" in the serial........
Both of these companies offered 'cheaper' quality guns after the change of ownership and employees......but often, sellers will ask prices equal to that of the "real deal" LC's and Foxes...just on name recognition alone, hoping they can 'snag' a buyer.....
Good Luck with your search.......
Can't speak for the Smiths, but I can tell you that the above statement about Foxes is drivel. Take each gun on its own merits. Some of the very latest Savage Foxes left something to be desired, but many of the Utica Foxes are every bit the equal of the Philly guns, as anyone who knows his Foxes will tell you.
The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits. - Albert Einstein
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,812
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,812 |
Some of the SW Deluxes from the EARLY thirties were heavy-weight crap cf. to say the "pin" guns of 1910. Fairly well-accepted drivel I'd say.
jack
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,164 Likes: 3
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,164 Likes: 3 |
As I said, each gun on its own merits.
The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits. - Albert Einstein
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 49
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 49 |
Well I see I've got some schoolin' to do. I was looking through some older issues of the DBJ that were still laying on the coffee table and they had several really informative articles about Ithacas and Foxes. It's always nice to read something with lots of pretty pictures! Once again thanks for all the good advice.
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