doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion Classic & Custom Single Barreled Sporting Rifles @ doublegunshop.com Custom sporters on website

Im not convinced. Has anyone here experienced a ruptured case? I think this relief is for loading convenience. i would like to hear from some one who has experienced a ruptured case in a rifle with this design. Arisaka has a hole in top of receiver. I think the bolt is slotted for the ejector not gas.
I had a ruptured case in my 700 Remington 7mm/08 varmint. Couldnt get the bolt open and lot of recoil only indication i had a problem. I was usinf 17gr. 2400 behind 160gr. cast. I have since heard of flashover problems with 2400 and light loads. Remington opened and checked the gun. NOTHING CAME OUT OF THE ACTION WHEN IT FIRED. NO GAS.
This is just my opinion.
Gas escape rout just sounds better than loading relief.I want to hear from some one who has a ruptured case rout gas through this relief.
thank
Tom

Tom,

Your opinion is certainly in the majority, I don't think I ever talked with anyone on the subject that did not believe the reason for the cut was loading.

The slots are holes into the bolt body not just grooves on the outside.

Ruptured cases and pierced primers were a big problem early on, today with modern brass and primers not so much. I believe that Paul Mauser lost an eye, I should check when and how.

Here is the text to the posted patent by Paul Mauser.

Hi Michael,
Mauser was also in the business of selling his rifles. I do not think that it is coincidence that the gas relief cut in the left rail is in the ideal place for it to provide thumb clearance for loading from a stripper clip. By getting a patent on it as a safety feature, he could prevent other designers from making a similar clearance cut and thereby have an advantage in the marketplace. He may have felt that if he just called it a thumb cut he may not have stood as good a chance of having the patent granted. The cut could be located anywhere along the left rail and still serve the gas venting purpose.

Just food for thought.

You shot your Lovell yet with the new brass?

John

The tang sight and the takedown system are both original M-S features. The tang sight is very clever in that when it is released to pop up, it is flexible. It allows the bolt to push it slightly back and then resets into position.

John, I have some (.22-Lovell) loaded but have spent what time I have at the range with the Hoffman .22 and Two .25-Krags.

Michael,
I suspected you had a good "hole card"- nice research!

Olson's writings support the gas escape theory with clip loading secondary, while Otteson and Dehaas go with clip loading primary and gas escape secondary.

In the FI ads announcing the new FN actions availability in the late '40s they stated "thumb-recess eliminated" among the features. Does this mean it was no longer needed, or wasn't a big deal anymore?

FYI, I have one of the very early post-war FNs. The bolt ports still exit the left raceway.

From reading the responses, it appears that very few of us have shot NRA High Power with a bolt gun.

Good shooting.

The popup tang sight on M/S rifles and also on some Mausers ... I think it is shown as an extra in prewar Stoeger catalogs was called a Baille-Grohman. Don't hold me to the spelling.

Some time back, my son and I were shooting (plinking) in an old quarry. The place was very dusty & windy. We & our rifles were soon covered with dust. My son was shooting an Argentine-made Mauser Model 1909 with a very pronounced flange on the bolt sleeve. He had a case head separation, with a lot of gas coming back through the action. I was on his left, watching him shoot and saw dust blown back against the bolt sleeve flange. Gas may or may not have left via the thumb cut, but the flange is what kept the gas out of his face.

Thank you
I had always thought the flange was the intended safety device. Makes more sense to me. Easier for gas to go around bolt than through it. Needs to be blocked rather than rerouted. Arisaka and Remington bolts go into barrel. This is what makes them so strong.