doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com "Press fit" stock turners

Being a selller of wood blanks, I am often asked to provide a list of stock turners. Too often, I am asked for someone who provides "press fit" turned stocks.

They do NOT exist!

There are "drop in" stocks (most often fiberglass stocks) which then require bedding in place with microbed or Accraglass. The stock is then painted to make it look like a perfect fit.

You cannot do that with wood. Gun metal varies a bit from the manufacturers. The wood stocks are them made a bit small so the tedious task of proper hand inletting will make a perfect fit (hopefully). Some stockers make a closer fit than others and one might specify a couple thousandths left to remove. The turner needs the metal for this and usually turns a pattern piece on a classy Hoenig machine or something similar, beds in the metal and then copies the pattern piece with a slight amount of wood left to remove. This is not as cheaply done as a large outfit using 8-gang machines and providing a rather rough (but cheaper) turned stock. The latter may well be under $100., but the former may run $300-$450. The former is certainly more money but saves a lot of time in hand fitting.

Final suggestion. Don't forget to use release agent!

Right on Pete, good info for the would-be restocker!
Best,
Steve

If you forget the release agent, and we have all done that at least once glass bedding actions, in the freezer overnight then whacks with a rubber mallet.
Ask me how I know, luckily it was my own gun, before I started to do bedding for customers! Pam works well for me, as does floor wax.
Mike

The point is that even with great help out there with turning many different types or styles of wood, the really great work is left to do. It takes a lot of time to remove tiny amounts of wood and fitting the metal to wood time after time until it is perfect. But you can do it. If you know what awaits you and don't get greedy with your time. Once the wood fits, there is more time ahead of you in the scraping or sanding. You can use heavy grit sandpaper with a soft pad and a power finish sander and still have a stock that looks like crap, or you can take your time with a hard block and keep sharp lines and flat surfaces without inundations. If you work fast, the work will be smeary. Take your time and the work will be crisp.

Look at a $20,000 Piotti. A stock with fiddleback will show loop d'loops where the softer wood has been undercut from the harder wood and someone has been screwed out of a whopper amount of money because the manufacturer has no respect for the wood. Some in Europe also have no respect for the art of checkering. It can make a very expensive gun looked buggered up. Of course, you can go nuts, too. One English trained stocker saw a magnificent checkering job without flaw and then was incensed to learn that it took 200 hours. The checkering on an English Best is not expected to take over 8 hours.

Now shotguns are a bit easier to do than rifles. Rifle design is such that some artisans make the designs with many sharp edges so that their attention to detail will show up in KEEPING those edges sharp. It might not make a lot of sense in a using gun as sharp edges get knicked and bruised and worn, but it shows the quality of work used by the artisan.

The bottom line is don't expect all the work to be done for you. Don't rush. Don't remove wood that you have to patch later (some can do that well, but not likely you). Keep lines sharp by thinking ahead. Don't use fiberglass when beautiful wood is available. I have it on good authority that St Peter won't let anyone into heaven who chose a fibreglass stock.

If we use this thread as a suggestion thread. I might add that for shotguns, the forearm is the most difficult part to do. For novices, I might suggest keeping their existing forearm and merely resanding and/or recheckering. Some guns are especially difficult like the forearms for the Browning Superposed's which require fitting three different dimensions at one time. Some Pratzee forearms are especially difficult. Maybe that is why Pratzee forearms seldom match the buttstock wood. Tight feather or burl on forearms can cause problems as feather can unleash considerable stresses (Crossed Chisels actually had one break the forearm metal once) and tight burl in a small forearm is simply waiting to break. Keeping the forearm plainer with correct color and lots of checkering to hide the plainer wood is an excellent idea.

Pete, would you address the idea of sending the original wood, if it is well fitted to the gun, to the stock turner to use as a pattern for your particular gun? I've never done this, but it would seem that if this were done, then the new one was requested to be a few thou undersized in the inletted areas, you would have the best possible scenario. Any drawbacks to this? Any chance of your original wood being damaged in the copying process?

Stan

I had George Hoenig profile and fit 2 stocks for Sakos back in the 80's using his pantograph. He made the stocks to his pattern with a more British classic style and the fitting was superb. I actually shot the .222 without the screws and getting the stock off required a mallet and some careful tapping.
Pete is dead on and you have to do some careful fitting when using even the most accurate pantograph,which the Hoenig is.I was lucky and was able to actually get Mr. Hoenig himself to do the complete job of fitting. The finishing and checkering I had done locally.

You can certainly use an original stock, but remember that most of these are mass produced and not perfect fits. One could use them after the stock is bedded. The exterior of the original is the place most likely damaged. This can be averted by using rubber tape to cover the stock so that the follower does not mar the wood or finish.

There is another problem. The stock turner will most likely use your wood or other wood which has been tested to be "dry". However, this does NOT guarantee that the wood will not move. In most areas of the country, "dry" is 12%, which usually takes about 3 years to obtain. However, the wood will usually remain unstable for another year after "drying". It will expand and contract quite a bit during this time. So a moisture meter won't tell all.

There is another problem. If your "dry" and "stable" wood goes to a turner in an area that is either a lot dryer or wetter than your area, even dry and stable wood will expand or contract when it gets back to you. This won't be as noticeable in a commercial stock which is not as tight fitting. This can lead to the stock cracking if it comes back to a dry area. I got one fitted stock back and barely was able to remove the metal. It required a complete reinletting by me. I had the turner put the stock behind his wood stove each day after he worked on my projects after that. Also remember to apply finish on the interior of the stocks including under recoil pads to help delay moisture intrusion. Remember that even a light coat of finish may change the fit. Not all finishes are equal in abating moisture intrusion. Linseed Oil is next to worthless.

All excellent points, Pete. Thanks for replying.

As to the prevention of moisture intrusion, when I used to build m/l longrifles I would seal the lock inlet, barrel channel and tang, and all other unseen places where wood is not finished with shellac. It has seemed to hold up very well over a good many years. I've got some built and finished this way back to '86, I think, and no problems.

Thanks.

Gents:

This is an interesting topic.

I have played with stock wood a lot over the years, but listening to experts discuss the minutia explains to me why my my Stevens has been so hard to fit. Of course, if I had more skill or patience it would be good too.

Thanks for the reminders- it really improves my appreciation for a well done stock.

Regards

GKT