doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com looking for my first side by side...

For 1500-2500 you can find a A Grade Fox-real clean Sterlingworth ,Parker VH a, Sauer or other nice German/Austrian/Belgium make that will always have good value and you will enjoy it a lot longer then a $500 beater that you will lose half when you go sell it.
The day I can't find the difference between a 500 double and a 1500 dollar one is the day I change my hobby.

I absolutely agree there's a difference, or my quail/opening day dove gun, now that I can afford it, wouldn't be by William Powell. However I have to disagree on the talk about losing money on all 'budget' guns, I wouldn't still be married, coming up on 25 years, if I'd lost money on all the beaters I purchased and then resold. For me the hobby/learning experience was a good chunk of the fun.

The "links" I provided should be good valued guns that he could buy and should be able to resale at near or above the existing down market price. It is a buyers market now.

If the guys budget is $500.00, then maybe Dave's idea of a German/Austrian, Simson Suhl or Sauer, ect, gun from Simpson LTD might be a better choice than a Spanish gun, buy I haven't had any experience with those. http://www.simpsonltd

My point is sometimes a budget is a budget, some of us have been there, and he shouldn't get the wrong idea that double gun owners are some elitist club you can't join until you spend $2,000.00.

The double gun, as most here would agree, is the best choice in form, function and history. So take all the good suggestions here and "jump in" where you feel, or your wife feels comfortable : ) , welcome to the 'club'...

Doug

L. Brown,

Are the Daly/Miroku's double trigger guns?

Doug

Good Morning Ted,
First, I removed my personal offering so as to hopefully negate any bias in my pro stance on the Browning as an ideal first side by side.
The current DGJ has an interesting article on the Browning BSS. If I may quote,
"The Browning BSS boxlock was possibly one of the best field grade side by sides marketed in the U.S. in the last half a century". "Excellent metel to metal and wood to metal fit". "Hand engraved". "Art Issacson, former supervisor of Brownings service and repair facility says The Browning BSS is one of the best boxlock doubles that he has ever seen".
Couple this with modern metalurgy, modern stock dimensions, and a price within reach (by the way, I think your assessment at $1000 is a little low) of the OP's budget and I believe this extremely robust double would make an excellent choice for a first side by side.

No questions regarding the original barrels from my "Frankengun". They were of the 30 inch variety and I had them mated to a Browning BSS Sporter frame, English stock, oil finish, single selective trigger, semi-beavertail forend. Add Briley thin wall chokes and I made my ideal Sporting Clays side by side. Shoots lights out on a Skeet field as well. Absolutely perfect fit.

Respectfully, Bob

One gun that turns up occasionally and seems to be a good value is the Dakin Arms imported version of the Antonio Zoli sxs. It was imported by Dakin in the 1960s and was configured for the American market at the time: Beavertail forearm, semi-pistol grip, selective single trigger, ejectors and a vent rib. Not the ideal for a game gun, but well done and (at least for the one I've owned for 25 years or more, which is not for sale) quite reliable.

I think you could pick one up for near the $500 level, or perhaps a bit more. They are not common and most people don't really value the name or the design features.

One note: Dakin also imported a number of Spanish made sxs shotguns, many of which were blessed(?) with the Spanish single triggers that seem to be less than totally reliable. The Antonio Zoli guns are clearly marked as such on both the barrels and the water table. There was also an Angelo Zoli importing guns into the U.S. later. These are a different maker altogether and seem to be much less well fit and finished than the Antonio Zoli guns.

Now we've done it, opened up the single trigger vs. double trigger debate : ) My vote, after using both - Double Trigger- for INSTANT selection of chokes on target, without having to fiddle with a button, slide, ect.... If it's your first double I'd learn it the "right way" with double triggers....

Doug

It doesn't cost $1000 to have a gun stock checkered, Larry. I didn't miss the checkering on my Western Arms, just didn't need a single trigger gun.

I'm not sure how one could lose money on a $500 Nitro Special, or, whatever. They are reliable sellers.

Mr. Cash, a roll pin is a roll pin. It is not, and never will be, the hallmark of a fine gun, regardless of what you read in DGJ. Serviceable, yes, fine, no. And serviceable guns are available for a lot less money than 1K+. My newest Gun List has several 12 gauge BSS guns listed around $1100 that have been there quite a while. WLM has a 12 gauge at $1250 that I bet you could own with 1K and shipping.

Selling one with mis-matched serial numbers will be a problem, regardless of why those numbers are mis-matched. As I said, I'm sure it looks and shoots fine. But it shouldn't sell for the same price as one that looks and shoots fine that hasn't been assembled from mis-matched parts.
Best,
Ted

I bought a Miroku-made, Hibiki/Kawaguchiya-marked 12ga double at a gun show last spring. Looked for all the world like a plain Birmingham BLE: straight/splinter/DT/AE. $400. I liked the gun and elected to put in Briley thin walls for maximum versatility. But I have absolutely no doubt I could've turned around and sold that gun for a profit, before the Briley work. I'm sure I still could, with the Brileys. So there are bargain guns out there on which you definitely won't lose money.

Doug, I'm not sure I've ever seen a single trigger Miroku-made sxs, other than the BSS.

Re the BSS . . . Personally, I'd prefer an Ithaca SKB Model 100. A good bit lighter, and I don't need the ejectors. But if you compare a 12ga BSS to what's available NEW on today's market, the BSS looks like a darned good value.

Good morning again Ted,
It's really more than just "what I read in DGJ". Having worked with Mr Isaacson on a few gun projects over the past few years, ranging from Belgian Supers to Japanese BSS's, I've come to respect and admire him not only for his real world wealth of knowledge and experience, but for the thoughtful and considerate gentlemen he is.
When an "expert" such as Art says that dollar for dollar, the Browning BSS is a fine a gun as any double (in our conversation I seem to recall he was comparing it to a Model 21 but don't quote me on that), I'll listen.
I realize of course his practical experience pales in comparison to your 2557 internet posts.
Best,
Bob

Pacrat,

Maybe you should skip the double gun, could lead to male menopause.

Doug