doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Screw-grip

The W&R sidelock, a screw-grip, was very popular and supplied in several original quality grades. Matter of fact, the screw-grip was a feature of several boxlock actions from W&S.

The left gun is an early 1890's Woodward and may be pretty near a London built gun. The middle gun is a A&W #52 (if memory serves), a middlin' grade BLE, and the right gun is the Woodward shown above. Note that the A&W uses a doll's head rib extension and the Proprietary uses a parallel sided rib extension.

Did Webley & Scott build the actions ?

Rocketman:

Well, I kinda, sorta agree.

The threads on the spindle don't engage the rib extension in any way, and therefore are not what fasten it. In order for the threads on the spindle to engage the barrel extension, the extension would also have to be threaded, which it is not.

The beveled TOP of the portion of the rib extension that extends beyond the doll's head (straight extension rather than doll's head on the Proprietary Hammerless Model) that is visible in the lower photo, engages a mating bevel on the BOTTOM of the rotary locking lug on the spindle (visible in the upper photo, just above the threads) - creating an interrupted screw thread interface on these actions. As the action closes, the top-lever/spindle rotates clockwise, tightening the "screw" interface formed by the angled surfaces on the rib extension and lug, essentially "screwing" the top extension down into the mortise in the standing breech. That's exactly how a Jones screw grip action fastens the barrels to it's action, and it's also how a screw grip fore-end fastener fastens the fore-end to the barrel loop. That's what a screw grip is. It's so named because it's a rotary lock that tightens an interrupted thread interface, and it had that name long before Webley & Brain came along.

The only Webley screw grip action that I've actually handled was a Bentley & Playfair box lock...the rib extension matched the pictures in the W.& C. Scott book to a tee....just like this one.



I'd like to see a side view of the rib extensions with the dolls head you guys say are Webley screw grips.

You do? Interesting, since they never made any.



Of course not.

These guns were Philip Webley & Sons developments and products, not W. & C. Scott's. After T. W. & H. J. Webley acquired W. & C. Scott in 1897, the separate product lines of both companies were essentially continued, until the Scott line was dropped in the 1930's. Webley's W & R and A & W models can be found in the Webley & Scott catalogs after the merger. I find them in both the 1914 and 1922 catalogs. You won't find them in a W. & C. Scott catalog.

Webley & Scott didn't make actions or guns for other makers ?

Are not Webley & W.C. Scott's product lines both shown in the same catalogs....if not I must have some bogus copies.

You said Scott, not Webley & Scott. You said "I do know Scott made lots of screw grip actions for other makers...". They didn't. W. & C. Scott didn't make screw grip top fastener guns. Philip Webley & Sons patented and manufactured them. After the merger, they were never part of the separate W. & C. Scott line, in the catalogs or in practice.

Generally, Webley screw grip top fastener guns and rifles built for other makers were provided complete, not as actions alone, although some were provided as proven barreled actions in the white.



Maybe you should read them. If you have a post-1897, pre-WWII Webley & Scott catalog, then you can find both the A & W and W & R models listed.

Sorry when I speak of Webley & Scott....Webley seens to get lost.

Understood.

The Tolley Giant Grip had a wee bit of wedge in it's fit.












Definitely a member of the 'screw grip' fraternity, this particular example (12-bore double rifle) swings a massive pair of balls too (fences that is...) with it's 3 inch case, 9 dram load and 1800+fpsMV!!



Cheers
Tinker