doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com William & Powell Liverpool Hammer gun

An old farmer has a William & Powell 10 gauge hammergun sitting in his closet. His description is that "it has been hunted with, but very well cared for. Some engraving, Damascus barrels (32") and english style stock with a couple of dings". I am going to go see it this week (Monday or Tues.) and was wondering what sort of things to look for with these guns. I never get a chance to see many english guns and don't see much info out there about w&p hammer guns in general.

Asking price is $500. ($500 doesn't get you much these days so I want to be educated enough not to get myself hosed out of my money)

If it's safe to shoot it's worth $500. Check: if it's on face/tight, wood cracks/oilsoaked, ribs for looseness, chambers to see if they have been lengthened, but most of all check everything about the barrels that you can. Pitting, wall thickness, and bulges.

It's Williams and Powell. They made some very fine guns in their history. I believe that one Williams and Powell that I had had the finest finished Stanton made locks of any gun I have ever owned. But, as in all cases, judge the gun, not the name.

This Williams & Powell is by far the nicest hammergun I've ever seen. It is finished to the highest standard and the workmanship is among the best. I don't think they ever turned out a poor quality gun. The locks on this gun are also by Stanton and are of amazing quality.

Meant to mention that there was/is a Birmingham maker by the name of William Powell. Easy to confuse the two. Williams & Powell were from Liverpool.

Joe-

Beautiful gun - one ofthe finest hammerguns I've seen.

I think we've talked about this before, but how does that thing lock up? I notice that its lumps are missing bites. And what's that thing next to the lumps on the bbls?

Is it nitro proofed?

Thanks for posting the pics.

OWD

OWD, the gun locks up on the lower rib extension, very similar to that found on Lefevers, Smiths or Foxs. If you'll take a close look at the lower extension you'll see the lower portion of it is somewhat rounded. When closing the gun this rounded area pushes the spring loaded bolt to the side. It was patented by W&P as the "Simplex" action. It worked but frankly there were better designs. I've wondered if they came up with this to circumvent Purdey's patent. The top lever is also unusual and probably did not invade Scott's Patent lever.

The thing-a-muh-jig running alongside the lumps is a split extractor. There are slots milled in the watertable that the extractor doglegs go into and when the action is opened the extractor is cammed to the rear for extraction. It is a very good design and eliminates the need to weaken the breech by boring a extractor rod hole through the lug. Its downside is it would be devilishly difficult to repair.

The gun carries its original black powder proofs. It is in nearly 100% condition, having been shot very little. In fact, it still has that stiff "new gun" feel to it. Nary a screw has been turned. Oh, I did have a good smith remove the locks once and what a sight they were. Underneath the dried 130 year old oil was the most beautiful lockwork I've ever seen. Not a speck of rust on the perfectly polished pieces. And the wood inletting appeared as crisp as if it had been done yesterday. No camera with me at the time and I'll probably never pull them again--that lock screw was tight--scared me almost to death when he put the twist to the screwdriver! Story on it is it came to the states at the end of WW1 by a returning doughboy and remained in its case unfired. At his death it passed to the grandchildren who had no use for it, etc....so I eventually ended up the proud owner.

Williams & Powell was taken over by W.Richards of Liverpool and has luck would have it, they are still in business; although it has moved to Poklington in Yorkshire. http://www.wrichardsguns.co.uk/index.shtml W & P guns are still made in that name, although usually in O/U format using Italian made actions. I think that he may still have the records. Worth a try. Lagopus.....

Lagopus, a couple years ago I called the firm of W. Richards and asked about any records of Williams & Powell. Was told none survived the war.

Sorry Joe. I know that he has the W.Richards and the T. Horsley records but wasn't sure about the Williams & Powell ones. Lagopus.....