doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Pigeon gun

Throny is right, passing off old fowlers as pigeon guns is all the rage now!
Count Lubzinski, nice brace of pigeon busters.

Thanks Jag, another British "club" that was built as a cross-dresser. fowler/pigeon, J.W.Tolley "Altro" model 3" BLE

Actually Lowell has made a valid point – not about pigeon guns being ‘clubby’ & ill handling (because they normally are not) – but about any heavy gun with lots of choke being passed off as one.

In recent years there’s been a growing tendency for auctioneers & dealers to call just about any heavy duty gun either a ‘live pigeon gun’ or if they want to sit on the fence call it a “live pigeon or duck gun” or some such description. I’m tempted to suggest that there’s been more “pigeon guns’ through the trade in the last 10 years than there ever were live pigeon competitors. Any S/S with a pigeon engraved on it seems to be fair game for the description as well.

It’s ironic that some of the early lightweight 4 bores which were built to shoot about 1-1/2oz of shot in live pigeon competitions (where & when rules permitted) are passed off as fowling guns (a role which they are unsuited too). No prizes for guessing which category attracts the best prices where 4 bores are concerned

Regards
Russell

I have a Boss & Co.c 1925 12b 30"x 3"chambered 1.1/2oz proof'Pigeon Gun', Built for a'Gent' in New York, Boss&Co Records)I was told by A Expert that the 3"Eng. was known as the British 'Magnum'?..What say our panel on this point?? The stock had been shortened ti 13.1/2",and a 'phoney'high comb/Monte-Carlo had been inletted to the original stock. I Restocked it back to the original Dims.Chokes are.022-.031. Another'Pigeon' Gun, Charles Boswellc1946 12x 2.3/4" 26.1/2" Barrels,.008-.034. 1.1/4oz proof. Stock length 13.1/4"!!!! According to Chris Batha Esq.Gun Fitter Extrodinair of the 1st.Water,Now Keeper of the Boswell Records & the Name,these'Specs' are all Original. I'm not Swift enough to post the photos here, but they are on http://www.gun-vault.com. under British Guns. I also have a Purdey"3 barrel set c 1881 'Built for the American Pigeon Shooter from New York Mr********.Still working on the Original Owners Name) #1 pr.12bx30'x2.3/4',#2pr.12bx32'x2.3/4' #3pr. 20bore 3.1/2'chambers x 32"length!!Damascus steel.Stock had been'Really Butchered" I have Restocked it back to Orig.JP Specs. CC

Dave is probably too nice to say it, but, perhaps wealthy Americans from the days of the robber barons could be a bit unelightened about gunfit and stock dimensions, and some fine English guns have suffered as a result. I too, have seen examples from the trinity that have been modified to look like a Parker lifter in stock dimension, and have been nearly moved to tears.
Best,
Ted

I used a W&C Scott pigeon gun for a couple of years for doves.
Behind a blind not really a bad thing, but doves are doves, you lose your interest in them and they move along.
Never one to use birds as live targets, and not intersted in the history of box birding the gun and I went different ways.
This subject would be batted around for days at SSM's site, never did I get the feeling anyone really shot in the ring.
They had a pigeon gun, so they were for the sport - I think!

"Probably built as a pigeon gun," gets your attention, while utility or keeper's guns gets the zzzzzzzzzzzz as you mouse by 'em.
Had both!
A utility grade Churchill, and a so called pigeon Scott, neither were for a day in the field. That is if you like a gamegun in your hands.

While following this thread I have come to the conclusion that my Stevens model 315 with 32" x-full chokes is a pigeon gun.It is definately very clubbish also.Probably so you can swat them out of the sky after you miss with your first two shots

Bill and I shoot with what I suspect is a representative flyer club here in N. VA. On a given Saturday, Ken's observations would be proved about right. One of our better shooters uses a Fabbri built as a pigeon gun. In hand, one has a sense of a late night liaison between a clays gun and a light trap gun. A "club" is most assuredly not a word that comes to mind. Several of our members use 21s. They range from Heavy Ducks to trap guns to a wonderful high grade dual trigger M/F field gun. I'll leave the argument about the handling qualities of the big Winchesters for another day and topic, but the old field grade gun is a lively thing. One of our better shots uses a wonderful old Purdey, damascus hammer gun with original heavy proofs. Tight and tighter drops them in the ring with authority and again, even an uninformed critic would not tend to think of it as a club. At those shoots over the last several years I have used a Greener Empire (32/F/F), AYA OU Mod 37 (30/IM/F), Beretta BL4 (30/M/F), Charles Daly Lindner (30 Dam/IM/XF) and probably a couple of others. My latest project is an Elsie Specialty set up as a trap gun (30/F/F), and I'll test drive her on a shoot before the end of the year. I have been in the money with all but the Lindner at one time or the other.

So, within their general range of use, "pigeon" guns can vary a lot depending upon trends (and remember a group like the above represents, in their gun selections, more than a century of trends), individual tastes, and what the shooter can afford. None of the above guns (with the possible exception of the BL4) is proofed or designed like a field gun, so comparing them with that genre is largely a waste of time. All would largely conform to Ken's list of attributes.

Comparing them to 1 1/8 ounce proofed game guns makes as much sense as bringing my 7.5 lb Lindner on a quail hunt, or my 6.5 lb Osborne into the Pigeon ring. Within the sphere of their intended use, the nuances of their differences are as intriguing to their users as are the ideas one sees in play on a clays course or skeet field. And it is a great sport.

Fred/RevDrew, Have taken numerous digital pictures of the glassbedding projects but the technical difficulties of good close,i.e. visible work keep defeating me. Further I'm an annalog guy trapped in the digital age and am computer challenged as to putting what I have on line. With that said, the glass bedding I do uses LOTS of release compound when reassembling the entire action. I also use a Dremel tool and burr bit to "undermine", particularly the rear lock contact surfaces. I have used Ken Hurst's "Krazy Glue painting" technique as a first step in the entire bedding process. It does a good job of "stablizing" fragile sidelock stock heads. I go beyond it in the 2nd/3rd step and do the undermining and pack the "channels" with Acra-glas. I reassemble the entire receiver/barrels/forend and then over the next 2-4 hours test the action/hammers for function. Time is temperature related as to how fast the glass sets up. When it is partially "cured"/no longer gooey, I take the entire action apart and let the semi-solid glass set-up for 24 hours. Obviously one wipes off excess glass that squeezes out during the process. If you have done rifle actions it is just like glassing the rear tang and area around the trigger mechanism. If you mess it up and get the "solid block" problem, judicious application of heat like a soldering iron will allow you to seperate the metal from the wood. First time it is a bit scary but thereafter it goes pretty easy. Good Luck, BILL