doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Hunting Health recap

Lipitor made my wife feel like she was dying, multiple side effects. Her numbers weren't really bad, just borderline, but the doc was a cholesterol nut - she hasn't gone back to him again.

All this talk of high chloresterol and you're cooking a whole prime rib? If you are bound and determined to run those numbers even higher, try that whole prime rib smoked very slowly until you get the internal temperature you want. I usually smoke over very low heat for around 7 hours total, it comes out with about 80% of the center will be rare, with a bit of medium toward the outside. Absolutely wonderful. Who wants turkey, anyway?

Chief,
It turns out my cholesterol isn't very high, that's why I'm a happier camper tonight. The primerib is my wife's idea. I prefer a NY steak. Thanks for the tip on your primerib. Sounds close to what I'm doing; keep the cooking temp unter 300F, more like 250 with some hickory or apple wood for smoke, some good rub and some beer...for me of course.


This is from a website on LDL/HDL

Your LDL (Bad) Cholesterol Level

The lower your LDL cholesterol, the lower your risk of heart attack and stroke. In fact, it's a better gauge of risk than total blood cholesterol. In general, LDL levels fall into these categories:
LDL Cholesterol Levels
Less than 100 mg/dL
Optimal
100 to 129 mg/dL
Near Optimal/ Above Optimal
130 to 159 mg/dL
Borderline High
160 to 189 mg/dL
High
190 mg/dL and above
Very High

Your HDL (Good) Cholesterol Level
With HDL (good) cholesterol, higher levels are better. Low HDL cholesterol (less than 40 mg/dL for men, less than 50 mg/dL for women) puts you at higher risk for heart disease. In the average man, HDL cholesterol levels range from 40 to 50 mg/dL. In the average woman, they range from 50 to 60 mg/dL. An HDL cholesterol of 60 mg/dL or higher gives some protection against heart disease.

Statins are intersting, if imperfectly understood. The benefits of the statins are not entirely a function of their ability to lower LDL. I know cardiologists who take the drugs despite having no baseline LDL elevations. Another class of drugs that appear to be win-win compounds are the beta blockers. The evidence favoring these is now so strong that we push them in the OR on just about anyone having both a big surgery and the slightest medical indication of CAD risk. We actually get dinged by the QA system for failure to give them. The number of perioperative ischemic events has dropped so decisively that I can see it even in my personal case volume. If you know anything about statistics in medicine - this is saying alot.

I take both classes of drugs, FWIW.

No argument with sensible diet, exercise, and good guns (even repeaters).

Sam

Samuel H,

I was shooting with an MD at a Vintager event last year and he was discussing the virtues of statins and memory in our typical age group. Any thoughts on that?

Builder,

My wife thinks I had memory loss way before I started taking statins.

When a side effect is described for just about any drug there is an inevitable flood of patients self-reporting those effects. Most turn out to be.......well, hypochondriasis. There are a small number of well-documented memory loss cases reported to date. But these have to be placed in the context of the huge number of patients taking these drugs. Even a very conservative estimate of the number of lives saved/annum by the statins totally overwhelms the memory loss numbers. There are books out in the lay press that have overdramatized the memory issue: these books do no service to consumers. But they sell.

Most well-reported cases describe onset within 60 days of starting the drugs. Median age was about 62. OK, but how many 25 year olds even check their cholesterol levels? About half the reported cases indicate successful resolution of symptoms following drug cessation. The bottom line remains (at least at this point) that the risk-benefit ratio is strongly favorable.

I'd continue taking statins.......if I could remember where I put the pills..........(oh, I'm just kidding!)

HTH,

Sam

Sam,
A couple questions;

One shooting friend in his early sixties and a bit of a health enthusiast, says his docs only care about the ratio of the LDL to HDL being within some number (3:1 or some such thing). Comments?

Are you going to get out to the Vegas show this Jan?

Chuck,

It's complicated and not entirely settled. The ratio is important: a high HDL to LDL ratio is better. But the total LDL number matters, too. I'm pretty sure I wouldn't want a LDL of 500, even if my HDL were 300. The exact treatment goals and what's considered treatment-worthy (this goes for high BP, as well as cholesterol) change over time. Newer studies are constantly emerging that refine these matters. I don't mean to equivocate, but there's a variety of opinions out there. OTOH, that statins are beneficial is beyond question......at least today.

I can go back about 25 years to the days when nitrates and pumonary artery catheters were believed to prevent perioperative ischemia (reduce risk of heart attack). But the notions were based on theory, not evidence. They have since been discredited. Beta blockers rule the roost, nowadays.

Sad to say, I'm pretty doubtful for LV this year. I'm trying to persuade my wife to come, but maybe next year.

Sam

For the borderline hypertensive:

Two years ago my AME was bitching at me for BP approaching 155. I started using a Magnesium supplement, and it dropped to below 140. Recently, I added hawthorne berry extract and fish oil to the supplements and BP now averages about 115. Of course, I did lose some weight but not a huge amount. Worked for me. Better than the battery of tests they want to sell you and the six month delay with your airman medical while they scratch their collective ass in Oak City.