doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Hammerguns are trouble, darn it.

Lloyd,

Why are you waiting 3 days? The gun was made before 1974 so there shouldn’t be a 3 day wait period in CO.

Ken

Ken:

Arguing with all the idiots here simply does not do any good. All the remaining gunshops in Colorado (many are either closing or are not handling guns anymore)) are shell-shocked and compliant, even when they shouldn't have to be. It's our new reality here and unless someone steps up with with a well-funded lawsuit (about the constitutionality of it all), that's where we'll be a for a while now.

Brent:

A few "snipped" pics...





I've never owned a own a "twist" gun before so this completes my "braided-tube variety" collection. Those massive 32-inch tubes easily weigh over 4-lbs and really swing great! Should be fun in Wittington, eh?

Who's the authority on Ithaca Hammer guns here these days? This one's not a "Baker Model" so that leaves us with the "New Ithaca Gun". I haven't figured out how the grades for those worked yet (Quality A thru Quality F). I'm guessing this ones a "D-Model" but.... thats just a guess right now.

I feel your Calirado pain, Lloyd, but I’m also happy for you. Looks like a wonderful find.

But…it’s a NIG. The Crass models for the overlapping years are the hammerless guns.

I like it. I would be fun to shoot with big loads. On a hot July day at the Whitt, I might wish for a lighter gun while slogging around the sporting clays courses. But she is pretty enough to be well worth the effort.

Randy: I was hoping you'd chime-in, how do you grade these guns?

Brent: We always seem to go down there in the Spring of the year, so the heat isn't an issue normally. It is a heavy gun (8 1/2lbs?) so... slogging around with it anywhere for very long really wouldn't be much fun. Thank goodness for golf carts and/or wheeled gun totes, right?

I swear I've seen smaller punt guns.

I'm fairly convinced that this one is a A-Grade gun now (from a Dr. Drew post over on Shotgun World back in 2017) because of it's "Twist" barrels.

"According to the best serial number chronology, the one in the second edition of Walter Snyder's book, the gun in question is from 1900. The AA was number three in the hammer gun grades. Quality X had Cockerill Steel barrels, Quality A had Twist barrels and the Quality AA had Damascus barrels, all on essentially the same receiver. From Walter's book "The new Quality AA was introduced during 1898. Like its kin, the Quality 1 1/2 hammerless gun that was also introduced that year, the distinguishing feature of the model was its Damascus Steel barrels." The Quality F, the highest grade hammer gun was dropped from the offerings between 1892 and 1894. In 1900, Ithaca Gun Co. built 2990 hammer guns and 4459 hammerless guns."

Dr. Drew is the gift that keeps on giving (both here and elsewhere it seems). Thank you again Dr. Drew.

Lloyd, “breeches so-thick they look like it might be a double-rifle” are actually by Ithaca intent. In the 1890’s when there was still a lot of disagreement about the safety of the transition from black to smokeless, Ithaca actually marketed their guns as having a “double thick breech” to try and reassure skeptics that they were safe with smokeless powder. However, I have only seen them advertised in 1898 - 1900 guns. So once you get the gun in your hands and you can double check the number and actually measure the breech wall thickness, you might have the latest “double thick breech” gun that I’m aware of. Also, at about the same time, the NIG got the bolstered frame that yours has (either late 1897 or early 1898.). As you would imagine these guns are stout.

I have the fraternal twin to your gun but in 16ga including those beautiful 32” twist barrels. Having a “few” Ithacas I have to say that none comes close to the smoothness of the action on these “double thick” guns. I’ve described mine as bank vault smooth. I hope yours is as well.

The patent for the NIG is dated 13 September 1887 with the first actual NIG being #6550, a 10ga made in December 1887. Production continued through 1915. The Crass hammerless doubles were built from 1888-1901.

In the FWIW Column here, the CSSA (the Colorado State Shooting Association) has just joined forces with the NRA to file suit against these latest State gun laws (gun bans).

As I loosely understand it, they are arguing that these new laws and "taxes" are being deployed as a form of a "poll tax" (similar to what was used in the Deep South to keep poor blacks from voting in the 1950s & 60s). Since these forms of "poll taxes" were found to be wildly unconstitutional many years ago now, the argument is that this particular approach (being employed by the presently Democratic-majority government here in Colorado) is also unconstitutional.

I guess we'll see, right?

That is a Quality A NIG. When you get the gun in hand, check the water table. It will have an A stamped in it.

Thanks Lloyd, but I suspect that information came from Dave.

Yep, the "Double Thick Nitro Breech"





Lewis era catalog hammer gun listing



BTW: the barrels would be Belgian Plain Twist. The English had long run out of horseshoe stubs at that point.
This is a Grade 1 Flues with Twist and the ‘H.R.F.’ mark of Heuse-Riga Fils and the Ithaca Nitro Powder Proved mark - what could they have been thinking!?!