doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Oldest gun made in America

Mike, I guess we'll have to disagree on this. My thinking is based upon knowing that 500 years ago, the Spaniards knew about the use of wheels, or pack animals like burros or llamas, to move heavy items. I think it is doubtful they would drag a gun or cannon barrel around with a small cord tied to the middle of the barrel. I can't think of any gun building culture that did something like that. Even primitive cultures learned that it is far easier to drag elongated items by one end, not the middle.

Nor would they intentionally add a tie point to pick it up off the ground after firing. Rather, they would come up with a design to keep it in the mount or carriage, and prevent it from hitting the ground. I just think it is probably a design flaw that could be corrected by enlarging the hole and using a larger diameter pin. I have no proof. Just making a guess using a bit of common sense.

More articles about the cannons
Pictures
https://www.texashistorytrust.org/t...coronado-and-houston-wall-gunsand-cannon

https://phys.org/news/2024-11-oldest-firearm-unearthed-arizona-bronze.html

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smar...es-of-the-coronado-expedition-180985688/
The two cannons are also known as hook guns or hackbuts. These were lightweight weapons that were relatively easy to transport on the backs of horses, mules or humans. When used in battle, they were typically placed on large, wooden tripods and probably fired by two men.

These are both Remington illustrations, and just that; not necessarily historical. Coronado's march through Arizona

The primary weapons here are pikes and swords



The soldiers here are carrying matchlock muskets with musket rests



The point is that, at least for this expedition, they were unlikely to be hauling heavy cannon but certainly may have had the hook guns
Interesting discussion of the 1540-1542 search for "Cibola"
https://southernarizonaguide.com/coronado-expedition/

keith.
I suspect that a "pin" is less likely than a rope or chord, but I freely admit that you may have more experience with the use and transport of these guns, since the oldest weapon I was issued was an M1 Garand.
Mike

I would have figured the hole was for a pin. A retention pin for the mount the gun sits in? I assume the large lug on the bottom just like the breech end of a muzzle loader barrel is meant to take the full force of the recoil and the pin would simply be there to stop the gun from bouncing out or from accidentally being shoved out while throwing it around (on its swivel mount)? Same way you put a cotter pin on your trailer hitch pin or on the end of a clevace bolt

Or maybe it it just locked the gun in the mount while it was being transported then it was removed when in use?
I'd be curious to see the type of mount a gun like this would have been placed in

16th century anti-personnel swivel guns:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swivel_gun

Senor Casualidad
Wall guns did not have a mount, they were rested on a wall/parapet/rampart or similar, with the lug hooked on the front side to absorb the recoil.
Mike

Except when they didn't

https://www.ima-usa.com/products/or...0176884805#mz-expanded-view-641435450751