doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion Classic & Custom Single Barreled Sporting Rifles @ doublegunshop.com Rust Bluing

Is it absolutely necessary to remove the barrel from the action when rust bluing? I have a 1903 sporter project that I am slowly working on and eventually will be looking to try my hand at rust bluing. Everything I have read indicates that the preferred method is to remove the barrel from the action for bluing and reinstall afterwards. My concern is ensuring the correct headspace when reinstalling the barrel. Some sources discuss the issue of crush fitting and the inability to regain the correct headspacing without setting the barrel back 1 turn and re headspacing. I don't own a lathe. Is crush fitting an issue?

Any advice, thoughts, and comments are welcome. I have looked through several older gunsmithing books and done several google searches but I cannot find anything conclusive. Most chapters on blueing discuss metal prep such as finish removal and degreasing.

Thanks,

Tom

No it's not. I've rust blued many complete barreled actions.

This one just finished:

Speaking of rust bluing , does anyone have a formula that gives a good deep glossy finish as opposed to the usual satin black ?

I wouldn't even think about rust bluing without removing the barrel.
So there you go�

Craigster, Is there no weep line at the joint?

Is there not a possibility of marking the newly blued finish with action wrenches , vices etc ? Surely if the interior of the barrel is blanked off with wooden or silicon bungs no harm can be done to a barrelled action ?

Steven, I know you always blue them separately. I've never had a problem with weeping at the joint. I used to either plug the barrel or coat it with varnish during the bluing process, but don't anymore. Before and after inspection with a bore scope looks the same. And how do you protect the new blued barrel and action upon reassembly ?

I always remove the bbl from the action. It's just the possibility of any oil or grease that is inside on those threads weeping back out onto the freshly blued surfaces with every coating that's done.
I may happen,,,it may not.
It may not happen on the first few coats, but then give you a problem on that last final coating you decided to apply just 'cause everything was going so great.

Boiling water and it's 212F degree heated steel liquifys any oil/grease down in there and it'll leak out at the most inopportune moment to spoil an otherwise nice job it seems.

Yes I'd gotten away w/o doing it. But I'd also paid the price of polishing and redoing a job or two because I didn't.
So now it's just the way I do things and has been for a long time.
Witness mark the bbl and reinstall back to that mark. There should be enough draw up if the bbl was installed correctly in the first place.
If there isn't and the thing just turns off with little or no effort to begin with,,you've got to fix that problem before ever worrying about rebluing it.

Careful handling, perfect fitting bbl jaws of poured lead that are lined with one wrap of newsprint and a sprits of rosin make sure nothing is marked during reassembly.

A higher gloss is obtainable with most any soln with shorter rusting times, sometimes addingin slightly lower humidity and temps.
Easy on the carding wheel pressure, let the wheel do it's burnishing work.
But some soln's and steel combinations just naturally are more agressive than others and will etch very quickly.
It just takes experimentation and experience to get to know what's what and even then the work will show you a new trick or two just when you think you've got it all figured out.
You'll never get a high gloss if you don't polish to one either.

I don't plug them or coat the bores either for rust bluing.

Reassembly is a known procedure because I've had the barrel on & off several time during the gunmaking process. I use business cards on the action wrench and normally a paper towel and a touch of rosin on the barrel.

My barrels are almost always new, not overly tight fitting and most often octagon held in octagon vise jaws in by Wilton bench vise. My normal barrel wrench is made from 1" square tubing, pretty lightweight by most standards. Many of my flat sided single shot actions are elaborately engraved and color case hardened so extreme care is required.

If a barrel is fit tighter than I want I will lap the threads until I achieve the proper tension. Witness marks and levels are used for re-alignment.

Let it be said that I have never removed, rebarreled or replaces a Springfield barrel, but I would use a similar procedure if I did. A crush fit barrel is Much too tight in my opinion.
I my advance Workshop we do a complete rust bluing (5 days) of students polished parts so they can learn the multitude of tricks and corrective methods I have developed over 30 years of rust bluing on their own parts. Also nitre bluing demo.

I no longer plug or coat the bores but am very careful with the solution, application, sweat box procedure and post clean-up. Plugging or coating the bore has no effect on threads or barrel joint weeping. I would be Concerned about rust in the threads if I didn't have the opportunity to properly coat the threads with rust proofing anti-seize on final assembly.

I often say, anyone can turn the metal blue by rusting and boiling, getting a finish as seen on a flli. Rizzini or Purdey barrel is quite a bit more complicated.

A couple different finished shotgun barrels, pretty shiny the way I like them. Both high polish and special carding procedure, Very Hot (aggressive) solution, 2 hour rusting, max.




Rust blued brl & tube, charcoal blued forend tip, nitre blued mag plug & screws.


Hagn action engraved & case colored ready for final installation


I'll see if I can find a barrel install photo tomorrow.

Thanks to all for the comments and photos, the more the better so please keep them coming... An amateurs follow up question for those that remove the barrel for bluing: Do you establish final headspace prior to bluing? I recall seeing photos of custom rifles being test fired in the white, so perhaps this is my answer? I am still thinking about final headspace. My action and barrel do have witness marks, so perhaps I will be all set. How will I know if the barrel was crush fit during installation? Is it just the amount of torque necessary to remove the action?

The look of the finish is also dependant on the level and type of polish on the metal. I can tell you that Mark Lee's gives a very nice dark black color with more of a shiny look.

I have also heard of people saying that barrels need to be removed from actions for bluing. But I have heard this in regard to hot salt bluing.
I would not think any issues with rust bluing would be encountered if everything is properly neutralized when finished and dried good and oiled.
The issue at a threaded barrel joint is really no different than ones that could be encountered on a Double barrel's nooks and crannies.

For Shotgun barrels, I use threaded rod all the way through the barrel with a rubber stopper in each end drilled out to a tight fit over the rod. Then a washer with nut on each end tightened as to tightly pull the stopper into the barrel. The length of rod extending out works great for handling and hanging. The rubber plugs keep nearly everything out of the bores, but the holes with the threaded rod thourgh them still allow air to vent while boiling. When all done, they are removed and there is always very little water in the bores. Just some drops here and there.