doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com batavia leader questions

hi, i have a batavia leader with Damascus barrels the gun has been getting loose (side to side movement) on the face while cleaning the gun today i noticed a screw on the back side of the hook, not sure what its for but i backed it out about a 1/4 turn and the looseness is cured. not sure this is an adjustment screw or not?? question 2. what do the initials ADH stamped on the bottom of each barrel refer to? question 3.do any of you gentlemen use your Damascus guns on game? partridge, rabbit ect? maybe even over decoys after ducks? thanks

'ADH' is Arthur-Delvaux-Heuse de Fraipont, Belgium and the mark has been found on damascus Lefever, Syracuse Arms, and Baker (both Baker Gun & Forging-Twist and Batavia-Damascus.)
More here http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dfg2hmx7_28dvjzkhgf

thank you drew, that was interesting to read. its quite a wide spread from a batavia to a lefever, i assume it wasn't the barrels that made batavia a cheap gun. although mine fits better than any other gun i own it doesn't see much use, except the occasional sabre tooth squirrel trying to invade my barn.

Please also see http://www.lcsmith.org/faq/safetoshoot.html and scroll down the FAQs to the "Shooting and Shotshells" section.

Baker, Syracuse Arms, and Lefever were three of the best arms made , and all in the Syracuse NY area.
And yes, I shoot many of my damascus guns regulary.

Craig

A Batavia Leader would be expected to have "Twist" bbls. These bbls are wrapped & welded similar to Damascus, but are not twisted in the bar prior to wrapping so have a spiral pattern rather than the swirly patterns normally referred to as "Damascus".

Baker/Batavia -- Baker references are --

The Double Gun Journal -- Vol 3, Iss 3&4; Vol 9, Iss 2; and Vol 14, Iss 4
American Rifleman -- June 1968
Shooting Times -- May 1962
Man at Arms -- Nov/Dec 1987
The Gun Report -- Nov 1989 and Jan 1991
Field & Stream -- April 1908
Guns Illustrated - 29th Edition, 1997

William H. Baker was dead before any of the sidelock hammerless Baker doubles built in Batavia saw the light of day. Even the trigger-plate hammer gun built first in Syracuse and then later in Batavia was designed by A.C. McFarland, Patent No. 370,966 granted Oct. 4, 1887. When the plant in Syracuse burned and they moved operations to Batavia, W.H. Baker was ill with TB and they brought in Frank A. Hollenbeck as plant superintendent. Hollenbeck had three patents granted while he was in Batavia and two are assigned to the Baker Gun & Forging Co.

The Batavia guns were the low priced or "field grade" models of the Baker Gun & Forging Co. To reduce costs the Batavia line did not have the "firing pin block safety" or the "draw block" which passes transversely through the barrel lug and mates into recesses in the frame, of the graded Baker hammerless guns and the Model 1897 hammer gun. After WW-I with the rise of repeaters Baker sold their gun business to H&D Folsom Arms Co. a major marketer, manufacturer and importer of low priced guns. Folsom added the 20-gauge to the Baker line that they produced. Folsom-made Baker guns normally have an F before or after the serial number. In the very last Baker ads that I've found in old sporting magazines from April and May 1928, and October 1929, Folsom also offered a 410-bore Batavia Leader, though I've never seen one.

During the Baker Gun & Forging Co. days there were several variations of the lower priced "Batavia" line. From a 1909 copy of The Baker Gunner -- The Batavia Leader had twist barrels and listed at $25 -- The Batavia Special had steel barrels and listed at $21.75 -- The Batavia Damascus had Damascus barrels and listed at $28 -- and, finally the Batavia Brush had 26-inch twist barrels and a straight-grip stock listing at $24 and offered swivels and a sling as an option for $3. There was also a Batavia Ejector that listed at $35 with steel barrels and $37.50 with Damascus barrels. About 1915 Baker Gun & Forging Co. discontinued all these "Batavia" models and replaced them with the Black Beauty and the Black Beauty Special. In 1919 Baker sold out their gun business to H&D Folsom. H & D Folsom revived the Batavia Leader name but with steel barrels like the old Batavia Special.

thank you for all the info and links. i actually think i knew mine was twist steel and not damascus as i have an article about the baker's in a bound edition rifleman, poor terminology on my part. are there strength differences between the two? mine has no color on it, except the wood. it was my great-grandmothers brothers gun so i hear. i think it was hunted hard but well maintained, no massive pitting or anything, all the metal is silver colored. i think ive fired it twice in the last 5 years, used to lug it a lot rabbit hunting but gave that up and got into coyote hunting with hounds, at the time i had a steel barreled batavia i shot a few yotes with. like a fool i sold it, looking back the double profit i made wasnt worth it lol.