doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Welding Up Hook on Barrels

Pardon my neophyte terminology here, please. Rather than trying to shim the hook on my project gun, I was considering welding it up and then filing and fitting to take up the looseness in the barrel/breech fit. I've done this successfully on an old set of barrels that were beyond any hope. I used my Mig welder on it. I have Mig, Oxy/Acetelene and Stick welders, but no Tig. Wish I had the Tig, but I cannot afford it right now. Any problems with using the Mig? Any suggestions?

The only big problem with a mig weld is the lack of control. You will probably deposit more weld that you actually need but so what. There are a couple of things that you should do to get satisfactory results. Take some thin aluminum sheet and cut a hole to just fit aroung the barrel hook. and wrap it around the barrel to protect it from sparks. Beer cans work great and the hole can be cut with a utility knife. I would use two layers of the aluminum since they are so thin. You also need to drink two cans of beer first also. I would then pre-heat the hook surface to only about 150 degrees. Be careful that you do not get the area to hot or you could soften the solder joints. Then have at it with the welder. I would keep the heat up just a bit and the wire feed down just a bit and simply spot the weld in a spot at a time making sure to keep an eye on the overall temp. If you can not quickly touch the surounding area with a bare hand on and off you are getting it to hot and need to stop. Keep the barrel in a good position to let gravity help flow the puddle where you want it. Also very important is to clean the area with a solvent before you start. If you get any purosity it will be a nightmare to get rid of. Good luck.

Bill g.

Like any new welding situation (to you), you would be well served to try welding a sample similar to what you are working on. A couple pieces of 1/2" square stock (bare, no cad plating) clamped together in a drillpress vise and then drilled at the parting line will make two samples with half round "hooks" for practicing.

I haven't welded a hook that needs it on one of my guns yet, but this would be a good way of making practice coupons for setting your MIG machine and trying your technique. A TIG will be much easier to control. IMO, a MIG is not a good choice for this work and makes it riskier that you'll make a mess. IMO, MIG welders are for production work. But, it can be done, certainly.

Good advice- TIG is the best method. I'd also recommend this: Use a Tempilstick for the preheat- they look like crayons, and are marked with the temperature range- buy one that says 150 degrees, and mark the HAZ area- when the crayon turns to wax and runs, that's your temperature- In a perfect world, MIG would work, but you might want to go with a filler rod that matches the metallurgy of that lug- and a smaller dia. (.022) such as the body shops use- sometimes known as "stitch welding" for ligher gauge sheet metal- also, consider a 100% Argon shielding gas- most fab shop MIG welders set up for HSLA steels use 75% CO-2 and 25% Argon for the shielding gas and a .045 70-S3 grade wire- and be fussy about the tip and cup on your gun- clean and without spatter-you will get less spatter and a "wetter" bond of the filler wire to the parent metal with Argon-but it is way more expensive- do you have a scrap barrel lug to experiment with first? How valuable is the shotgun you want to rebuild the barrel lug on? If you have an older Davis or Crescent- sure, go ahead- but if I had a FE AH Fox or a Monogram L.C. Smith- I'd only go with the TIG process- IMO-O RWTF!!

On the old barrels I practiced on, I used the Mig with 0.025 wire and tip. I have extensive experience with this setup welding light guage auto sheet metal up to chassis frames for old truck restorations. The gas I'm using is actually the reverse of usual. For some reason I ended up with a bottle of 75% Argon/ 25% CO-2. This will be done on a couple of AJ Aubrey sxs's I have. My practice barrels were on an old American Gun Co. wallhanger and it is now tight as a drum.

Ok the hook is welded up.. Now you're going to cut the precision radius with a file? This sounds like repair done on desert island as last resort with tools that washed up on the beach. Why not send the gun to a professional and get it done right?

How do you think we do it? There is a step by step view on it on my website and I posted it here a while back. It is pretty much the standard way, with lots of patience and lots of carbon from a smoke lamp. No magic involved, just precision work.
Steve

cherry bomb,
Travel to the Gardone Valley in Northern Italy, there you will see the finest craftsmen operating multi dollar cad cam machines and cnc machines roughing out forgings for some guns destined to become 'Best' these are then sent to Birmingham England UK where wizened, elderly, cigarette smoking, metal butchers have at it with a file.Finally and finely, finished these now complete guns are sent to the London Proof house for testing, upon successful proof they find their way to the 'Best' London gunmakers to be sold to Texan Oil Barons.Hope you enjoyed the tour of the guntrade, now get the smoke lamp out, the numerous files and silicon paper and 'Have at it'

This isn't Gardone Valley or Leige. This is free advice on the internet, some good, some bad. I've looked at dozens of hooks on factory guns and all cut to size with milling machine indexed to location, and end mill ground to diameter matching the pin. Perfect radius. Then final fitted with spotting technique. A CRAFTSMAN with file can do it on rough welded hook but they are men that apprenticed and did many hooks with some rejects along the way. Here we have someone doing it right first time and getting fit correct in the X, Y and Z axis. You can get a gun rejointed by one of several craftsmen for $2-300. And you're going to try yourself with a file and advice from savants on the internet? Good luck man..

Funny thing Cherry Bomb, I've restored 12 Vintage Mustangs, two Vintage Chevy Trucks, built a dozen or so quality muzzleloaders, and have been tinkering with handguns and rifles most all of my 52 years. Oh yeah, I also restored five vintage and antique aircraft back in the day. What I've found out in my life's journey is that there are a lot of folks who possess the skills to be professionals and never become one, and then there are a lot of folks who become "professional" who should have found a different trade (including mine as a former professional land surveyor, and now Christian Pastor). Before you rush to judgment, please realize that many of us learn from the internet, books, dvds, and sage advice of fellow gunlovers and experts. Also, be aware that for some of us, $200-300 is not "chump change", but represents two weeks groceries. We may not be wealthy, but we can still enjoy and appreciate a fine old double barrel. I've spent my life resurrecting old treasures and returning them to practical service.

In the future, perhaps you should read a little more here on the internet to acquire the knowledge you apparently lack, before you rush to judgment. Frankly, you've embarrassed yourself. We know it, you know it, and now you're attempting to rationalize your condescending behavior. I personally would appreciate it if you would refrain from further commentary on my posts when I am seeking advice from a group of professionals and fellow doublegun fans. You see, I am seeking knowledge and wisdom. You've not offered either.