I saw a gun marked as such in a pawn shop today and it piqued my interest. I thought I would easily be able to look it up when I got home, but all I have found after reviewing pictures and posts were references to the Charles Daly branded guns and a few others names that Lindner manufactured guns were apparently sold under. Furthermore, none were similar to the one I saw.
It also had a Jones underlever and an escutcheon forearm mechanism. The hammers were the very straight upright iteration found on very early hammer guns as opposed to later ones that were curvier (please excuse terminology). Original quality looked very good with excellent wood to metal fit and clean engraving.
Anybody seen anything like that before? Really wishing I had taken a pic, checked the proofs and taken down the serial number down.
It was mechanically rough - the Jones under-lever just flopped open and the extractor piece would not orient properly to close. Still hate to see a gun like that sitting on the shelf collecting dust. Would love to know more about it if anyone has any information. Who knows, I might pick it up as a decorative piece next time I am out that way.
Thanks!
Dan...What was engraved on the rib?
Was it priced like a wall hanger?
perhaps a fixer up'er if cheap enough?
If you manually pushed the extractors in, would the Jones lever work then?...sounds like broken guide rod on extractor
Snap some picks next time.
cheers
Franc
Can't remember what if anything was engraved on the rib. I suspect if it was an address I would have noticed.
It was priced as a wall hanger. And the barrels appeared to have a lot of meat in them and were not heavily pitted. Barrels were probably off face, but hard to tell given the other issues.
I couldn't really tell what was going on with the extractor - when the gun was open the extractor would sort of rotate out of place. The Jones underlever seemed to have nothing holding it in place. So something was either broken or missing internally.
The stock was fine, forend was a little mangled and the locks seemed to operate properly.
I will be back in that area in a few weeks and will get more info if it hasn't sold.
If it is actually marked "Lindner", it is one rare gun if not faked up.
As Dave in Maine says, buy it. I doubt you'll regret rescuing it.
I see the tag on the gun says Linder, not Lindner [as in Daly guns] . Where did the Linder name come from ?
Tag is wrong - it actually says Lindner
Dan, where does it say Lindner ?
Beginning directly above second trigger top-middle of lock
Saw that. It says something following Lindner that appears fuzzier. Do you know what that is?
what does the tag say as far a money????
I blew the picture up that Skeetx posted. I think I see Lindner on the lockplate, followed by two letters that might be N and C. The letters could be different, though. Do you have any proofmark info or other marks ?
Looks like it says Lindner NC or & C, can't really tell due to resolution.
Shop is asking a few hundred give or take. Lot of condition issues though.
Didn't get a chance to look at the proofs. They weren't great about customers disassembling guns.
Dan, the gun is a pretty one, but there must be things the pics don't show. It's certainly worth a few hundred, if only as a curiosity . The hammers look British to me. The way the gun is signed, Lindner could be a retailer as lots of bought in guns were signed like that.
If it is marked Lindner, and not faked up, it is well worth buying. Is there an initial before "Lindner"? Where is the marking, on the rib or on the lock?
eightbore, no initial that I can see. Marked on the lock. Not sure if it said anything on the rib.
Daryl, agreed that the hammers look English like off of an old converted pinfire or something.
Is it just me, or does this hammergun appear to anyone else to be a conversion from a pinfire mechanism? I remark the thin breech area, as well as the fact that it appears the one hammer that can be viewed does not align at the head with the exterior firing pin. Its hammer-tip also appears to have been broken off, as it is flat and squared, and the shape of this hare-hammer looks very similar to those usually found on a Pape gun.
Also, from the text of the initial post, I have the impression that the subject gun is perhaps somewhere marked "Charles Daly," and at this point it is simply an assumption that the gun must have been made / finished by either Georg or Heinrich Lindner.
It would, of course, be a great find, even in its deplorable condition, if the gun indeed evinces Lindner indicia, and if it is not spurious. But I would tend to doubt that it is a Lindner gun, though it may be marked Charles Daly; one trade name does not necessarily follow the other.
I hope that I am wrong, by the way.
Regards,
Edwardian
I don't think the gun was ever a pinfire if that's the original receiver. Conversions can be anything, but there is no room for the "hammer rest" on the top of the standing breech that a pinfire hammer needs.
In the way of an update, I went back and looked again, the gun was marked "Lindner & Co.". The action bore one proof mark that looked a lot like an early London proof mark with a V with something over it. I decided to pass when a cursory inspection through disassembly revealed what I believe were barrels off an American double (no proof marks) extremely crudely fitted to the action. Even if someone blew up the originals, they could have likely been salvaged through a sleeving job. However, some infinitely wise person decided to toss those and substitute a "new" retrofitted set. C'est la vie.
"Dan," this gun might be a post Civil War product or an assembled product of the Amoskeag Manufacturing Company, a New Hampshire located manufactory with which the inventor Edward Lindner was associated at time of the American Civil War. The company built a very limited number of rifles based on Lindner's innovative design, which productions are some of the rarest rifles manufactured for the war effort and also a much sought after prize for the period gun collector. These rifles usually bear only Lindner's name, but sometimes evince "EDWARD LINDNER'S PATENT MARCH 29. 1859" neatly stamped at the breech.
It is possible the business relationship did not end with the close of hostilities. Alternatively, Lindner might have sourced a company in England and had the parts imported and assembled in the United States by the Amoskeag Manufacturing Company, and then used the brand name "Lindner & Co" as the abbreviated maker name for the resultant product. All of this is pure speculation, and is only provided to further advance the discussion of the subject gun.
Regards,
Edwardian
Edwardian, thanks for that information. It seems like Amoskeag was primarily involved in the manufacture of muskets or rifles. Are you aware of any double guns coming out of that outfit?
Here are some more pictures of the Lindner that may or may not aid in identification.
http://s304.photobucket.com/user/djangofandango/library/Lindner?sort=3&page=1In any event, if I am correct that the original barrels are lost, I would think identification may prove exceedingly difficult?
Dan S.W.
Here is my two cents worth. If it is a Lindner, and therefore German; if it was made before the proof law went into effect, it wouldn't have proof marks on the barrels. If the same gun were "in stock", when the law went into effect in May of 1893, it should carry a crown V ,showing it was made before the law(vorrat).
Mike
Der Ami, that is interesting information. The plot thickens, I suppose. I guess I will have to take a third look at this gun of extremely dubious provenance next time I am out that way, if still available.
I really felt like the barrels were not original as all the parts that connect with the receiver seemed to have been recently filed and crudely at that (in stark contrast to the action). There was also a blob of suspiciously fresh silver solder between the hook and the breech portion of the barrels on the rib.
"Dan," I do not personally know of a commercial hammergun or gun made by Amoskeag, but perhaps another correspondent here may have greater insight regarding the same. If this company was involved, in accordance with my speculations above, then it would more likely have been as an assembler of imported parts and not as a manufacturer of the product. There was a lot of private label activity during this historical period involving arms and parts sourced abroad, which lasted well in to the next century.
The "Lindner & Co" gun seems to have led an unattractive, improvident and uncertain life. You are probably correct concerning the barrels being from another gun altogether. It would seem too that its offering is not in good faith, when it is increasingly obvious that extreme alterations have been performed to cobble the thing together for the purpose of selling the result to a gullible buyer. It is a shame to see an antique unfeelingly and recklessly destroyed in this fashion, as it should have been left alone and its remaining dignity left intact. Regardless, I have enjoyed the mystery, entertaining the possibilities and the research concerning the subject gun, and wish to thank you for bringing it to our attention.
Hopefully, someone will rescue the piece and place it over the proverbial fireplace mantel where it can reside in unmolested peace. I have great empathy for elder metal and wood, and for that forgotten sportsman with this his pride and joy afield sometime in an era now long past.
Regards,
Edwardian
Edwardian, I appreciate your contributions and sentiments equally. Thanks for both.
In any event, I plan to check in on that gun periodically as it inevitably goes unsold for years. If it ever becomes available at a bargain basement price, I may pick it up as a mere curiosity if only to pop the locks off in the hopes of continuing to explore its origins.
