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Posted By: Lloyd3 Dating a Stevens 520 variant? - 07/18/13 07:01 PM
The early guns had the double hump-back and the suicide trigger (inside the trigger guard), the next variant had the safety moved to the back of the trigger guard, the final variant had the safety moved to the top tang with the receiver being more streamlined to remove the front hump. Can anybody give me a sense of the dates when theses changes were made? I just scrounged up a Western Field 16 that is the early version with a four-digit serial number that I'd like to figure out.

I know, yet another pump-gun question....
Posted By: 2-piper Re: Dating a Stevens 520 variant? - 07/18/13 09:29 PM
Quote:
suicide trigger (inside the trigger guard)

I thought inside the trigger guard was the accepted place for a trigger. I do assume you meant the safety instead.
Posted By: Lloyd3 Re: Dating a Stevens 520 variant? - 07/19/13 01:40 AM
I'm sorry, yes the safety. Did this at work and got distracted. The three variants were: safety inside trigger guard, safety behind trigger guard, and then safety mounted on upper tang behind action. From my reading, I'm seeing production beginning in 1904 and ending (for the 520A) in 1932. WWII briefly restarted production of the 520A as a trench broom. I'm seeing claims of the first model changing about 1920, with next change around 1928 (when they went to the one-hump receiver). I am told by one of the venerable members here that the Stevens production records were lost in a rather suspicious fire and bankruptcy in 1920 (the Feds were investigating some contract irregularities from WWI). Savage took over shortly thereafter. I was also informed by Researcher that Stevens produced 520s marked as being made by them in 12 bore only. Only Ward's Western Field marked guns and Sear's Ranger marked guns could be had in sub-gauges (16 & 20). Can anyone elaborate on this outline?
Posted By: Researcher Re: Dating a Stevens 520 variant? - 07/19/13 02:40 AM
The No. 520, John M. Browning designed pump gun, was first introduced in the J. Stevens Arms & Tool Co. Catalog No. 52 (Revised Edition) which is circa 1909-10. From the 1912 Shotguns catalogue --







These guns were only offered in 12-gauge. In the 1927 J. Stevens Arms Co. catalog No. 57, they introduce the streamlined No. 620 in 12-gauge and the old No. 520 becomes a Riverside Arms Co. gun, still only in 12-gauge.



In 1928, the 16-gauge is added to the No. 620 offerings. For 1929, the J. Stevens Arms Co. moved the No. 620's safety to a cross-bolt behind the trigger. By June 30, 1930, the 20-gauge version of the No. 620 is ready for delivery.

The No. 520 does not appear in any of the Stevens or Savage/Stevens/Fox catalogues in my collection after its 1927 appearance as a Riverside.

The smooth-top, single hump gun doesw appear in the 1951 Savage/Stevens/Fox parts catalogue as the Model 520A --



We know these guns were made for the government and as "trade brand" guns for Montgomery Ward and others, but they don't appear in any of the Savage Arms Corp. paper I have.
Posted By: Lloyd3 Re: Dating a Stevens 520 variant? - 07/19/13 04:18 AM
OK, that would make the appearance of the single-hump or "Riverside" version about when I had surmised, and, it confirms that they made them in tandem for quite a while with the 620. It does looks, however, that the "suicide" safety continued far-longer than I had thought, well past the 1920 estimate. Can we assume that the appearance of the 620 was the end of the double-hump model? Somewhere around 1927?

Something else I have gleaned about these early John M. Browning creations, is that there were two frame sizes, and much like the Model 12 Winchester, 16s and 20s were built on the smaller frame. Researcher, do you know of any Sears or Montgomery Wards commericals or cut-sheets that detail the options for the sub-gauge guns?

This 16 I just secured has a 26-inch barrel. That shorter barrel length, combined with what is hopefuly a 20-gauge frame should make it a bit more lively than it's 12 gauge brethren.
Posted By: Kutter Re: Dating a Stevens 520 variant? - 07/19/13 04:29 AM
I've owned Model 520 12ga (early style receiver) w/solid rib, checkered pistol grip stock & forend,,trade name marked Montgomery Wards.

Standard field gun marked 'Model 520-30' (later style receiver) 12ga 30" Full w/ Stevens, Chicopee Falls markings. Just sold that one last year.

Early style receiver 520 12ga w/ hang fire safety mechanism. Only one with that feature I've ever run into. I think these were very early in production, but just my guess.
Counter weight that is just barely visable from the bottom. In a cut in the inner left rec'vr wall, rear of the carrier.
Otherwise you'd think the bolt lock/release isn't working.

Late style 520A 12ga field grade w/ factory installed adj choke.
3 position choke. End of bbl was swaged slightly for installation. I've seen a few others as well.
These had Stevens markings on them.

Some guns have choke markings, some have the choke designation done with (*). Some don't seem to have choke designations at all.
Some in 12ga are not even gauge marked.
Some carry a 'Browning's Patent' marking on the bbl, others not.






Posted By: Lloyd3 Re: Dating a Stevens 520 variant? - 07/19/13 12:12 PM
Kutter:

Here's what is confusing for me, back in May of this year I was looking at a very nice Sear's Ranger 20 bore that was the double hump version, but with the safety located behind the trigger guard. I had thought that only the later "Riverside" single-hump versions had the different safety locations. I just tracked down the Armslist posting for that gun and it definitely is the double hump version. How do you explain that? All the rest of Browning's creations are fairly easy to identify and date, these Stevens/Savage guns are almost impossible to catagorize. What was going on up there at Chicopee Falls? Multiple lines and multiple models running concurrently?
Posted By: Lloyd3 Re: Dating a Stevens 520 variant? - 07/19/13 12:22 PM
I just looked more closely at the last advert (1927?) that Researcher posted. My error was in thinking that the "Riverside" guns were the later 520-30(?) models with the flat-topped receiver. Were the 520-30 guns only produced for the War Department effort? Ok, more close looking at Researcher's last posting. So...the 520A is the flat-topped receiver as well? Whew! Can we now surmise that 520 production ran from 1904 to 1927?
Posted By: Lloyd3 Re: Dating a Stevens 520 variant? - 07/19/13 08:37 PM
Way too much time on my hands today. In my reading, someone mentioned that the 520 shares some of the features of the Anthony Burgess shotguns made in Buffalo, NY so I went looking. Lo and behold, the takedown features are very similar, strikingly so. I'd guess old JMB was paying attention to the Winchester takeover of Burgess in 1899 or thereabouts. You hear so much about all of the innovations being made in England at the turn of the last Century (the 19th), but little is mentioned about all of the great ideas that were bought-up (and buried?) here by the big boys (Winchester, Remington, Colt, etc.). Even a quick review of the Marlin pump guns from 1898 shows how much folks were looking at each other's wares for ideas. A facinating period of history, both here and across the pond.
Posted By: Kutter Re: Dating a Stevens 520 variant? - 07/19/13 11:27 PM
Generally, (not a set in stone rule as someone will always be ready to show you a gun that doesn't fit the categorys)....

The '520' is the early receiver style with the steps to the profile. These have a flat spring mainspring and trigger spring mechanism. Trigger guard safety.
(The entire trigger mechanism inside reminds you of an early A-5 when you first see it)


The 520A is the later receiver style with the straight line top and bottom profile lines. Top tang safety.
These will have a coil spring trigger and mainspring mechanism.
I've always believed these to be 1930's manufacture, but I don't have any paperwork to prove it at hand. I may have read it somewhere but that doesn't prove anything.

The 520-30 was the WW2 Military designated Stevens Riot & Trench Gun 12ga marking on the receiver. (Coil springs, top tang safety)
But I had a sporting gun (30" Full) Stevens marked 520-30 that I sold not long ago. So there's one of those that doesn't quite fit the category.

I also recall reading that the 520A sporting gun had (just) been discontinued before we entered WW2. Needing shotguns for the War effort, Savage brought the machinery back out of storage and set it up to produce the 520-30 for Gov't Contract.
620's were also made to fill the contract.
The folks & forums that collect the US Military Trench Shotguns would probably have info on this as well as some serial number range for at least the War time manufactured guns.

I think the 520(30) again went away after the War. The 620 continued on.

Wards & Sears had their own Models designations stamped on them other than the 520 series. Sears used the catalog number as usual for them.
'Ranger' & 'Western Field' were trade names used for those firms.
It seems as though I had a Sears/'J.C. Higgins' marked 12ga also. But that would imply post WW2 mfg if that J.C.Higgins name was on it I think(?).
I've owned way too many of these and there was always differences however small even in guns seemingly made during the same time periods
I don't believe anyone will ever sort these out.

Speaking of how mfg'rs were looking at others products for ideas,,,I have a Meriden pump 12ga.
A simple but nice handling light weight shotgun. Not a lot of them around.

The bolt/sear/striker assembly and the takedown adjustment features are very similar to the Remington Model 10 shotgun.
Meriden pumps were made in only one year,,1918 IIRC.
The bbl is marked 'Krupp Fluid Steel'.
The op-rod is marked 'Savage Patent'.
Posted By: Lloyd3 Re: Dating a Stevens 520 variant? - 07/20/13 04:54 AM
Kutter:

Thank you, I suspect that you are right. It's of no consequence really, I was just curious and I've had the luxury of time to indulge my curiosity. These guns fall into a period of history that I never took the time to understand. As a kid growing up in the 60s & 70s, pumpguns were ubiquitous. Everybody had them and most used them for everything, from hunting to competition. My Grandfather liked doubles and used them. I thought he was the definition of wonderful, so if he liked them then I did too. Fast forward 40-years, I have the doubles I always wanted and occationally, I get to use them. I am protective of them and use them fairly selectively. What I didn't have was a utilitarian option, something to use when the weather was lousy or the hillsides and grapevines were too steep and thick. With the guns of my youth (albeit, lighter & more deliberately chosen versions), I now have that option. And, what's even better, is that I'm finding them to be as fun as I remember them being. A rediscovery of sorts, made more fun because I didn't have to break the bank to do it.
Posted By: Lloyd3 Re: Dating a Stevens 520 variant? - 07/21/13 08:13 PM
http://www.searsarchives.com/products/questions/firearms/detail/firearms_1933.htm

Can't find anything from Mongomery Ward's, but here's the Sear's Ranger from 1933. $20 used to buy a lot in this country! Now, If I was any good with technology, I would have gotten the advert to post the way Researcher does his.
Posted By: ChiefAmungum Re: Dating a Stevens 520 variant? - 07/22/13 01:06 PM
Lloyd3
I imagine that 20 bucks let alone 45 was hard to get together in '33! Tough times for many. It is interesting to note that Sears only catalogs 12 and 16 ga guns except for the 520 variant. Note the long barrels and full chokes. Indicates the market of 1933? Now the 16 is a niche ga. and full chokes are not popular. Now where the heck did I park that time machine?!

Chief
Posted By: Lloyd3 Re: Dating a Stevens 520 variant? - 07/23/13 03:50 AM
Chief:

That advert has me thinking that in order to save money they just kept re-running the same one year after year. By 1933, the 520A had arrived and IMHO, the suicide safety was no-more. Also, almost every 20-bore variant I see is a Sear's Ranger. Go figure? Moreover, $20 bought a lot more in 1933 than it will now (that's what printing money out of thin air will get you). But you're right, those were very tough times. As to all the full-choke guns I see from that period, I suspect that shotguns were used much more like rifles to kill immobile game animals because every shot had to count (wingshooting would've seemed frivolous to them). Also, shells from that period used felt and paper, so patterns were hard to control any other way.

Got my 16 today. So much for svelt, this unit goes well over 7-lbs (almost 7lbs3 by my kitchen scale, I'd hate to see what a 30-inch 12-bore weighs-in at!). The suicide safety is an odd-bird too. I'm hearing the early Auto-5s used it, and I can see why they moved-on from it fairly quickly. It's not very positive (this gun won't be used as a loner). Other than that, I'm fairly pleased with it. Very Bonnie & Clyde looking, which to my eye is somehow pleasing. It's no Model 12 clone, and it doesn't look like anything else I've ever owned, but the metal forging and machining is first rate, and the take-down is way cool. I'm going to open the choke and try to lighten the stock up just a bit, but.....it is what it is. A wonderful conversation piece in any circle of gun nuts, for sure. I may try it on doves in a few weeks here. Recoil certainly won't be an issue.
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