Can anyone enlighten me as to when Whitworth steel began being used in gun barrels? Looking at a very early gun with fluid steel and trying to figure out whether or not it has been re-barreled at some point. Thanks!
Steve

Sir Joseph Whitworth's adaptation of Bessemer's principle of hydraulic pressure casting was patented in 1874. The first Purdey Pair Nos. 10614 & 10615 were delivered January 1, 1880 with the "New Whitworth Fluid Pressed Steel."
Lefever Arms Co. was the first U.S. maker to supply Whitworth steel for their Optimus in 1887.
Parker used Whitworth for the first AAH Pigeon Gun in 1894 SN 79964 delivered to Capt. Du Bray.
Hunter Arms supplied Whitworth steel on the Smith Monogram, A2, and A3 in 1895.

Dr. Hause, I didn't think you knew anything about that new fangled steel?

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Gotta know the enemy
The Art of War, Sun Tzu

The Field Oct. 20, 1888 “A Shoot On The Moor” by Thomas de Grey Walsingham
"On August 30, when I killed 1,070 grouse to my own gun in the day, I shot with four breechloaders. No 1, a gun made in 1866 by Purdey, subsequently converted from pin-fire to central principle, to which new barrels were made last year. Nos. 2 and 3, a pair of central fire breechloaders, made also by Purdey, about 1870, for which I have likewise had new barrels. No. 4, a new gun made by Purdey this year to match the two mentioned above, but with Whitworth steel instead of Damascus barrels. The guns are all 12 bore, with cylinder 30 in. barrels, not choked."
“Whitworth steel barrels are not desirable for a heavy day's shooting. The explosion in them makes quite a different sound from that given off by Damascus barrels: there is more ring about it, and I can imagine that this might prove a serious annoyance to anyone who minds the noise of shooting. Moreover, the Whitworth barrels became hot much more rapidly than the Damascus, and this is a serious drawback...I am replacing them with Damascus as in all my other guns.”

Thank you!The gum I'm researching was made in 1882, early but not too early.

Steve: In addition to the trademark "sheaves of wheat" stamped on the bottom of each tube, Whitworth barrels were usually stamped with the company's serial number for each tube on the barrel flat. I do not know if those records exist.

Ok Drew, we now know Whitworth steel was first used about 1880 in gunmaking. So now I need to know when did gunmakers discontinue the use of Whitworth steel in their gunmaking?? Thanks.

Thanks drew! More good info.

Matsak

Were most of the early ones sourced from Kilby's shop?

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

So if Walsingham shot 1,070 grouse in a single day how many shots did he miss?

At some point does it really matter what material your barrels are made of after that many shots?

Heck after that many shots my ears would be ringing, my check aching, shoulder nearly broke and a massive headache, all in addition to simple being worn out.

Hunter Arms is reported to have been providing Whitworth barrels on request for Monogram, Premier, and DeLuxe guns into the 30s, but they could have been tubes on hand.
Joseph Whitworth & Co. merged with W.G. Armstrong & Co. in 1897
http://books.google.com/books?id=nqAOAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA24&lpg
which was acquired by Vickers in 1924
http://books.google.com/books?id=GiX55Fn4MugC&pg=PA67&lpg

Thanks Drew.

I would rather have a 1870 thru about 1910 gun with damascus barrels....after 1910 you can be pretty sure they had the bugs worked out of fluid steel.

I have nothing against a set of damascus tubes in good shape, my most recent purchase is barreled with damascus. This gun that has me interested is an early best gun with Whitworth tubes. If they are in sound shape with sufficient wall thickness then I will feel quite comfortable shooting them.

Is the maker a secret ?

Quote:
:Moreover, the Whitworth barrels became hot much more rapidly than the Damascus, and this is a serious drawback...I am replacing them with Damascus as in all my other guns.” "

The statement that fluid steel barrels become hot quicker than damascus is probably true. But perhaps that's because the fluid steel barrels aren't vented like a piece of Swiss cheese!
Jim

It is interesting to note that when Damascus and steel barrels were being made and exported here and abroad, the Damascus were more expensive to buy. Now it seems to me that if they were more expensive to buy, why would gun companies still use them.

Sir Joseph Whitworth barrels were put on many guns, and for the English guns, that were light, more metal had to be removed from the barrels to make the gun lighter. Since 12 ga. guns were in the 6 lb. + range, it doesn't take much shooting to get them hot.

I would guess that the use of Whitworth steel as of that of Seimens steel would have been phased out by many gunmakers when the respective patents expired .Other manufactures of steel would then make similar steels without having to pay royalties . Don't forget that there were great strides in both steel production and the development of alloy steels around this time . You only have to look at the number of different steels that barrels are marked as to see . Purdey continued to mark their barrels as Whitworth but I think this had more to do with marketing than anything else .

The last Whitworth tubes used by F Beesley were delivered to him in 1924. Thereafter he used Vickers steel tubes, no doubt reflecting the takeover of Whitworths by Vickers. The last Vickers tubes were delivered to Beesley in 1937, a couple of years before they were bought by Grant & Lang.

Tim