Originally Posted By: Steve Culver


Quote:
I also wonder what house manufactured the barrel sample you have in your possession? Was it of high quality, or one of the "belgian clunkers" from a substandard manufacturing process?


The barrel tube that I have is of Belgian manufacture. It is of two iron Crolle pattern. This I find a bit unusual, because most of the Crolle pattern barrels that I have seen were made of three twisted rods. I expect that this tube was intended for a lower grade gun. However, I view the workmanship of welding it to be superb. I doubt that they intentionally made "clunker" barrels. Some may have been made with the intention of keeping labor costs down; like perhaps with the barrel that I have. I expect that barrels of complicated damascus patterns, like Bernard and chain, were more likely to be welded by experienced smiths, due to their skill of uniform manipulation of the material. Barrels were probably graded after finishing and etching to display the damascus pattern. Barrels with very uniform patterns would be saved for best guns, while less perfect patterns were sold for use on lower grade guns. I doubt that the steel and iron used for barrels, were different for best barrels and lower grade barrels. The steel and iron would not be the major cost factor in barrel making and it would not be cost effective to run different grades of material. Too, it would be best for the barrel welders to always work with materials that they are familiar with.


Thank you again, for taking the time to answer. I was asking about the maker of the tube because of the widely held belief in the vintage gun community that significant variations in quality exist in the pattern welded gun market. The term JABC is used to identify guns which are not usually even considered for safe shooting by members of the vintage gun community. I think it is safe to say that tubes produced by Henri Pieper are considered near the top of the pile in terms of quality, and therefore, consider more likely to be SAFER for shooting today.

Why the difference in quality? I suspect that the main difference is the manufacturing process (duh!) and perhaps a difference in materials and "additives". Sort of like the difference between Coca-Cola and a generic cola, or McDonald's French Fries and the ones you might buy at the gas station deli stop. Pieper didn't tell the rest of the Belgiam gun making guild his trade secrets, but I've read that the top American gun makers all sourced their barrels from a select few providers, Pieper believed to be among them. Was that strictly a cost driven decision, or had Pieper and the other "quality" tube producers demonstrating superior quality (safety) to the marketplace?

I believe Drew's study has the potential to alleviate or perhaps begin to change the way the shooting community views pattern welded barrels, depending upon the depth of the research. It might also demonstrate that pattern welded barrels shouldn't be kept in use. Who knows? Either way, I do not think the outcome of Drew's testing and analysis will do anything to change the view of anyone regarding the safety of shooting those guns we refer to as "JABC". I believe that the experience of the shooting community has demonstrated that JABC barrels are far more likely to pose a safety issue. For that reason, I was interested in understanding a little more about the comparison of the two materials - Drew's and the one you imaged.

The visible separation of the materials within the metal was far more evident in your sample than in Drew's micrograph. The basic point of my question is pretty simple...WHY?

Do we have two apples cut open, or is one of them an orange with understandably different grain structure?

Last edited by Jawjadawg; 03/24/14 12:29 PM.